Helping The Enviroment

[The PIT]

It seems that the Government sees the Enviroment as another way to tax the public. Latest one you're going to be taxed on the rubbish you throw away despite already paying for the service.

What I'd like too see.

1) Proper public transport system rather than toll roads etc that tax you for daring to find a job in another city.

2) Larger and easier to obtain grants for people to install their own Wind Turbines and solar panels.

3) All new building to be properly insulated and have solar panels and Wind Turbines installed by default.

4) Companies forced to pay for collection for excessive packing. I.E a one foot cardboard box for one bolt is over the top don't you think???

5) Junk mail companies have to dispose of there own junk. Return to sender.

6) One Million pound pay out to to any CEO who gets a full production car to do 100 miles to the Gallon around town.

Should do for starters any other ideas to add to this.

[I can't believe it's not better]

Grey water systems on more houses. In a hard water area it makes sense to do washing in soft rain water.

[SnowBear]

On charging for rubbish removal by weight, not all recyclable waste goes on to be recycled, saw an article not so long ago where it appeared some was going to land fill even though people had separated their rubbish, besides, whats going to happen in reality? more fly tipping.

Solar panels are a great idea, not so sure about wind turbines even though they are the best probably for the UK, unless you had "community" wind turbines, one for a certain amount of houses. Solar is best during the summer, I believe Lightning Ed has a solar set up so he may be best on giving thoughts on that one. Regardless, if everyones lighting was solar powered in the late spring, summer, early autumn, that alone would be a huge saving on the power grid resources. Lets say an average of 5 40w bulbs burning in every home, thats 0.2kwh per house, how many millions of homes? If wind power does a sizable part of the rest of the year when we are all using more for lighting....

Building codes should be including solar panels as standard, all have to be insulated already, floors, walls and loft spaces. Also many could be on ground source heat pumps for heating and cooling, using only the equivalent energy of a fridge to run the pump, physics does the rest.. a thread we had elsewhere discussed ground source heat pumps http://www.netweather.tv/forum/index.php?s...p;hl=heat+pumps, these again could be a shared resource for say a block of 4 or 6 houses depending on effeciency/size of pump.

Yep, junk mail, AOL had theirs returned, millions of cd's were sent back to them lol

Edited September 1, 2006 by SnowBear

[Snowly does it]

Superb Thread!

I would like to see much more emphasis on local produce and a severe diminishing of the overlords of supermarketry.

Food to be sold without excessive and environmentally ruinous packaging.

Housing kept off flood plains.

Change in emphasis from profit to social responsibility.

Renewable becoming a key word.

Recycling not being an excuse to hype out council tax further.

[SnowBear]

Grey water is an great idea I can't, we all like to water the garden, in hotter countries the houeses have water collection tanks underground for collecting bath water, washing up water, water from the washing machine, and rain water, a skimmer removes leaves and debris, if it overflows, it goes down the sewer as normal, but, always water for the garden, without using tap water which costs to filter/clean at the water companies plants. Gardens dont care if a little soap is in the water, in fact it can be good, aphids hate soap so it is almost an inbuilt pest control!

I did look into a grey water system once, cost?...alot, but if the demand was there, and a drive by the govt put in place, costs would come down, and that goes for all types of cost saving energy.

Why wont they? as we discussed on the other thread about heat pumps, govt wont, too much revenue in fossil fuels Once you have renewable energies, govt doesnt get hardly any tax, unless they tax the wind, or tax the amount of sunlight you have......

[The PIT]

Missed one

All Companies have to install Solar panels and Wind Turbines.

[Snowly does it]

Missed one

All Companies have to install Solar panels and Wind Turbines.

And publish their carbon index in their annual reports

[The PIT]

Why wont they? as we discussed on the other thread about heat pumps, govt wont, too much revenue in fossil fuels Once you have renewable energies, govt doesnt get hardly any tax, unless they tax the wind, or tax the amount of sunlight you have......

I can just see it Sun Tax. Everyone wanting a dull summer. Well there was a Window tax once upon a time.

The real blocking in any real enviroment improvement is of course the Government (Any Government thats elected of course) and the companies supplying the energy.

And publish their carbon index in their annual reports

And if they pay out dividends they have to pay 40% too improving public transport etc rather than there share holders if they're bad in carbon immisions.

[Stratos Ferric]

I can just see it Sun Tax. Everyone wanting a dull summer. Well there was a Window tax once upon a time.

The real blocking in any real enviroment improvement is of course the Government (Any Government thats elected of course) and the companies supplying the energy.

And if they pay out dividends they have to pay 40% too improving public transport etc rather than there share holders if they're bad in carbon immisions.

And the government won't change policy because?

[Snowly does it]

And the government won't change policy because?

We vote them in on a different manifesto.

It will take a sea change of priorities to make governments act or include these sorts of policies.

The greens taking Kemptown next time around might be the starter

[The PIT]

And the government won't change policy because?

Silly question. Who gives the Government Money? Follow the White Rabbit.

[Thundery wintry showers]

On waste taxes, I'm actually in favour of taxes on waste if carried out in conjunction with 'carrot' measures like improving recycle facilties, and there is some evidence that here, for once, the authorities are actually making some effort to provide them.

Of the points above, locally installed wind turbines and solar panels are IMO a great idea- becoming more self-sufficient for energy may tend towards a society where energy use is physically limited only by availability of renewable energy, without need for additional draconian restrictions, which to me sounds quite a good prospect. I am also in favour of the idea of more geothermal plants, as brought up a couple of times by Osbourne One-Nil.

Trouble is, politics and economics get in the way. These kinds of policies require short-term economic and political sacrifices, and in the current world of free market short-term profiteering, they don't win many votes. "We vote them in on a different manifesto"- it's probably either that or we wait until some catastrophic floods make economists see action as better than inertia.

The point about renewable energies being hard to tax reminds me of the point on the road charging thread that governments want to move away from taxing fuel, as if clean fuels become widespread (and taxes on consumption provide a 'stick' to push us towards this), it may be hard to maintain current tax levels without having some other charges in place. We may well see that sort of thing cropping up in other subject areas where fossil fuel consumption is taxed, shifting the tax burden over to energy use depending on the place and time of day. That will help make people use energy more efficiently, but won't help encourage use of solar, wind and geothermal energy...

[The PIT]

On waste taxes, I'm actually in favour of taxes on waste if carried out in conjunction with 'carrot' measures like improving recycle facilties, and there is some evidence that here, for once, the authorities are actually making some effort to provide them.

Well we've already recycling options just the tin and plastic bins to come yet the prosal is too tax us on collection. IF they do I'll burn as much as I can as we pay taxes already for collection.

I'm sorry if they want us too cut down on waste stop giving us huge boxes for CD's DVD's and stop sending us junk mail.

Also how is the Governement going to help someone like Mother who doesn't have clue what needs recycling. Just think old age memory problems and probable Alziemers.

I also walk to work unless I'm ill or going shopping. I use the car to go into the peak district as Buses are run for profit and don't run regularly.

Edited September 1, 2006 by The PIT

[Thundery wintry showers]

I'm sorry if they want us too cut down on waste stop giving us huge boxes for CD's DVD's and stop sending us junk mail.

I agree- indeed, I personally can't see why they love bringing CD/DVDs in such big boxes. As well as expecting the general public to cut down on waste, they should be doing the same for businesses. However, they're less interested in offsetting business interests, due to the short term profits issue again.

I agree with much of what is being said; I just doubt that those in authority will take notice. Like Parenides3, sometimes I feel pessimistic that greed will come before common sense until disasters start to happen.

Edited September 1, 2006 by Thundery wintry showers

[Nick F]

Just like joe public should be doing their bit to reduce waste and reducing energy use, supermarkets and large companies should be doing their bit aswell, afterall, this will rub off on the people who work for these companies or are their customers/clients.

Supermarkets, I feel, can do so much more to help the environment. For example, they should stop the use of air freight to fly in perishable vegetables and flowers from far flung countries to feed the insatiable all-year-round need for produce. Also they can increase much more the use of 100% recycled material in their packaging and at the same time introduce biodegradable packaging and reduce the amount of unecessary packaging; they can stop the issue of free supermarket carrier bags like most supermarkets on the continent - rather sell long-lasting bags which the customer brings back each time they shop; they can/should have wind-turbines on every supermarket and/or solar panels on the roof to reduce the need to use mains electricity from unrenewable sources. Sometimes companies should be setting an example to the public, rather than vowing to public trends - if all supermarkets do it then the public has no choice.

Many public and private businesses big and small, but especially the big national/multinational companies should save alot more energy, how many people have seen acres of offices in London or other cities/towns in the UK leave their lights on at night?! How many carparks are left lit all night when there's no-one using them? - this applies to supermarkets aswell.

I know there are many initiatives and new laws coming to help this, but I don't think it's a enough somehow to what can be achieved.

Edited September 2, 2006 by Nick F