Snow Patches Surviving on Scottish Mountains

[firefly]

http://www.highland-instinct.co.uk/gallery...r200708/08jun6/

Late-season skiing in the Cairngorms! Wonderful weather to boot.

[firefly]

Fresh snow on the high Cairngorms this morning at 0900 hours. All but gone by 1015.

Reports of May's average temperature in Scotland being 2.4 degrees above normal: the highest since 1914.

[mungwaterbabbage]

Fresh snow on the high Cairngorms this morning at 0900 hours. All but gone by 1015.

Reports of May's average temperature in Scotland being 2.4 degrees above normal: the highest since 1914.

Ah but May was pretty dry, which I guess explains why the snow hasn't exactly been vanishing quickly. It's that warm SW hairdryer and rain that really strips back the snow - something which has been largely absent since February and long may it stay that way. Imagine how much snow there would still be without the 5 day thaw in February..........

[Norrance]

I was up in Perthshire at the weekend and could see some fair sized patches on Meal Garbh, An Stuc and Lawers. Further West there are good patches in the Heasgarnich and Loch Lyon area.

[firefly]

Thanks Norrance.

I plan to visit Heasgarnich in late June, so I'll take some photos when I do.

I don't suppose you got any snaps of said patches did you?

[Norrance]

Sorry Firefly. No photos.

You should still find some snow in the area at the end of June this year given the forecast and the size of the patches around. From memory there are patches in a hollow near the summit that last quite well [at least they did in the eighties].

[Norrance]

Speaking of Perthshire mountains the attached picture [hope it opens] shows the ridge I think out from the North of Meall Garbh, North East of Ben Lawers taken from the upper Tay valley. [borrowed from Abefeldy weather].

The larger snow patch is usually the longest lasting easily visible one in the Lawers area without actually getting up there.

Edited June 19, 2008 by Norrance

[uk_snowman]

Firefly:

I've uploaded photos taken from Beinn a' Bhuird on the 20th, looking towards CairnGorm (south-eastern side) and also Ben Macdui, here:

http://www.highland-instinct.co.uk/forum/read.php?1,6992

Also photos taken on the larger CairnGorm snowpatch here:

http://www.highland-instinct.co.uk/gallery...200708/08jun21/

PM me with an email address and I can provide larger versions of the ones looking towards Macdui etc, and also send photos of snow in Coire Ardair on Creag Meagaidh on the 18th (where there is still fairly large amounts of snow in some of the gullies), and also photos showing snow in the eastern corries on Beinn a' Bhuird, also taken on the 20th.

Cheers

Jamie

[Coopsy]

Some photos from Glencoe on Saturday (31st May) from Jamie at Highland Instinct:

^Looking up to the snowfields on Meall a' Bhuiridh from the Access Chair.

^Spring snow turns in the Canyon on the middle slopes (approx 2500ft).

More: http://www.highland-instinct.co.uk/gallery...200708/08may31/

My question would be is this all natural snow or partly man made?

[firefly]

My question would be is this all natural snow or partly man made?

All natural. Lots of snowfall this year at Glencoe, hence the considerable depth in some sheltered gullies/aspects.

[Thundery wintry showers]

Just a couple of points about the Weather article on 2007's snow patch survival:

The article itself is excellent up to the conclusions at the end, but the final statement that 2007 had the highest patch survival since 2001, and the second highest since 1996, is inaccurate. It would make sense to the layman, as 1996 and 2001 were the two coldest years of recent times. However, 1996 (0 patches) and 2001 (2) actually had very low snow patch retention due to the bias towards snowfalls from easterly winds.

2007 (9) had the highest snow patch retention since 2000 (41), which in turn had the highest retention since 1994. However, it was only the third highest since 1994, because 1995 also had more snow patches survive- 18 in the Cairngorms alone.

[stewfox]

Just a couple of points about the Weather article on 2007's snow patch survival:

The article itself is excellent up to the conclusions at the end, but the final statement that 2007 had the highest patch survival since 2001, and the second highest since 1996, is inaccurate. It would make sense to the layman, as 1996 and 2001 were the two coldest years of recent times. However, 1996 (0 patches) and 2001 (2) actually had very low snow patch retention due to the bias towards snowfalls from easterly winds.

2007 (9) had the highest snow patch retention since 2000 (41), which in turn had the highest retention since 1994. However, it was only the third highest since 1994, because 1995 also had more snow patches survive- 18 in the Cairngorms alone.

How does one count 41 snow patches

I assume 'snow patches' are monitored ?

I assume snow could fall any time of year at the top but would quickly melt, the patches I guess are more robust

In a nut shell how do you define a snow patch

I assume a dirty bit of snow from last winter , not a 3 day thing from a late June snow storm ?

Edited June 24, 2008 by stewfox

[firefly]

Just a couple of points about the Weather article on 2007's snow patch survival:

The article itself is excellent up to the conclusions at the end, but the final statement that 2007 had the highest patch survival since 2001, and the second highest since 1996, is inaccurate. <...>

However, 1996 (0 patches) and 2001 (2) actually had very low snow patch retention

Yes, we are aware that there is an error with the report. An erratum will be inserted into next year's report.

It was the largest number since 2000, not 2001. The statement that it was the second largest since 1996 is correct. So the only error is saying 2001 when it should be 2000.

In a nut shell how do you define a snow patch

I assume a dirty bit of snow from last winter , not a 3 day thing from a late June snow storm ?

Correct.

It is defined by a snow patch lasting through to the first (lasting) snows of the new winter

[Norrance]

Walking up in Perthshire on Sunday I could clearly see four patches remaining on the Glenlyon hills during cloud breaks. Looking West white could be seen through cloud on the South East side of Lawers. Tried photos of former with mobile but as usual with me did not come out. Was a real pity as there was an eagle soaring above as well. [Photos and attempted video of eagle are in the camera[phone] somewhere but I couldn't retrieve them.] Will get my daughter to have a go at the weekend.

regards

Nor.

Edited June 25, 2008 by Norrance

[Thundery wintry showers]

Yes, we are aware that there is an error with the report. An erratum will be inserted into next year's report.

It was the largest number since 2000, not 2001. The statement that it was the second largest since 1996 is correct. So the only error is saying 2001 when it should be 2000.

I'm pretty sure that a few of the earlier Weather articles on snow patch survival mentioned 1996 as having no patches survive at all (e.g. 1999's article referred to 0, 2 and 1 patches respectively in 1996-98, and 2006's article referred to no patches surviving in 1933, 1959, 1996, 2003 and 2006). I'm a bit confused as "2nd highest since 1996" would normally imply that 1996 had a higher number of patches survive. The last year before 2000 to have higher survival than 2007, according to the earlier articles, was 1995.

I hope this isn't taken the wrong way- I'm not trying to have a go here, I'm just flagging up what I can see as being potential inconsistencies so that, for example, they aren't repeated in future years, especially as I see 2008 having a high chance of beating 2007's total.

[firefly]

Britain's most southerly snow patch on Ben More (map ref NN432246) still holding firm. Was up there this morning and it's 103m long from tip to tail, though not great in depth.

I would imagine this would last to mid-July if the current weather continues. This is fully 1-month+ longer than 2007.

Temperature at 3600 feet was 7 celcius with a very chilly breeze blowing.

[Essan]

Some decent sized patches on the northeast slopes of Meall a Bhuiridh (Glencoe: White Corries) visible from the road on the 19th and again on the 27th June

[Thundery wintry showers]

...

I'm a bit confused as "2nd highest since 1996" would normally imply that 1996 had a higher number of patches survive.

...

I'm thinking of one possible circumstance in which "second highest since 1996" could be accurate- could it be referring to the series conducted in Weather not starting until 1996, in which case 1996 would be the first year of records? In that case it makes more sense.

[firefly]

Terrific tour of the high Cairngorms today doing a snow patch survey. Started at the car park and walked up into Coire an t-Sneachda. Up into Coire Domhain then round the back of Ben MacDui via Lochan Buidhe.

Then ventured onto the summit of MacDui (in thick mist) down into the snowy corrie and around Shelter Stone to above Hell's Lum. Then over by the Stag Rocks round the back of Cairn Gorm to Ciste Mhearad. Dropped back into the car park via the normal path down. Probably about 15-miles all told, and never below 3000-feet (save for the start and the end).

Some huge patches still around, and the snowy corrie on MacDui in very, very good nick. A slide show of the day's proceedings can be found here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28183399@N03/...946767681/show/

[firefly]

Excellent tour of Aonach Beag and Aonach Mor yesterday to see the condition of the snows. Pretty much identical to 2007. Possibly a tad more than this time last year, but not much to choose.

Some of the gullies are choked with snow, preventing access down to the corries to get a proper look. Easy Gully on Aonach Mor and the goat track access on Aonach Beag are absolutely loaded (see images).

Images here.

A picture of me not looking to pleased at access being barred is here

Edited July 5, 2008 by firefly

[Cookie]

the link dosent work firefly!

[Terminal Moraine]

It worked o.k for me. Impressive amount of snow, I'd be interested to see what it looks like in anonther month.

[firefly]

Try this link: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28183399@N03/

I can't edit my last post for some reason.

[❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️❄️]

I find this one pretty amazing: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3033/263664...1135702.jpg?v=0

And this one looks pretty good: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3169/263664...b7a0ffe.jpg?v=0 Image in it winter full of snow!

Edited July 8, 2008 by RAIN RAIN RAIN

[firefly]

And this one looks pretty good: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3169/263664...b7a0ffe.jpg?v=0 Image in it winter full of snow!

Here it is on May 25th! Absolutely loaded with snow. I wouldn't like to guess at the depth in that corrie in late March-early April. Many tens of feet deep.