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Tornado in Hautmont, Nern France 030808


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Posted
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)

    The dreaded mini-tornado being used on the news this morning, one elderly woman killed:

    http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=65579...ionid=351020603

    post-1052-1217833175_thumb.jpg

    Noticed Estofex updated their forecast to a level 2 in the evening for that area:

    post-1052-1217833201_thumb.png

    SYNOPSIS

    Please refer to the convective forecast.

    DISCUSSION

    ...Northern France, Benelux countries, western-central Germany...

    A frontal wave has developed over the British Channel and will move across northern France and Belgium / Netherlands towards northwestern Germany and the Baltic Sea until Monday 06 UTC. Along its cold front, a convective line developed over northwestern France, now moving ENE-ward towards Belgium and western Germany. Ahead of the frontal wave that is currently located over southeastern England, SFC winds have backed to south over northern France with increasing LLS and SRH1 forecast around 400 J/kg. In the last couple of hours, discrete cells with rotating updrafts evolved over Belgium and likely also over the Netherlands and northern France. Current thinking is that some weak and probably a few strong (F2 - F3) tornadoes could occur both with more isolated as well as linearly organized storms. Apart from tornadoes, some severe gusts are expected in the whole LVL1 / LVL2 area as well. As a few hundred J/kg MLCAPE are forecast over central Germany, strong QG forcing should allow tornadic storms and isolated severe gusts over western and central Germany during the night hours.

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    Posted
  • Location: Egham, Surrey
  • Location: Egham, Surrey

    Death toll at 3 now. Looks like a violent tornado no mini tornado http://www.connexionfrance.com/news_articles.php?id=299

    Found some footage of the damage http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=RRhobTdJFLM&...-a-haumont.html

    and another http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FHFaevoDY4

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    Posted
  • Location: Lancaster and East Devon
  • Location: Lancaster and East Devon

    Oh dear looks like quite a big event then and its sad when peoples life's get involved like this. I find Extreme weather like this very interesting its just a shame how it can destroy peoples homes or worse.

    Certainly no mini-tornado <_<

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    Posted
  • Location: Cambridgeshire Fens. 3m ASL
  • Location: Cambridgeshire Fens. 3m ASL

    Why do they have to say mini tornado. A tornado is a tornado surely. It can't have been that small looking at the destruction caused and the sad loss of life.

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    Posted
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)

    I'm afraid it's the ingrained UK Media's perception that 'big' tornadoes don't happen in the UK and Europe and only occur in the USA. With 3 people killed, that would be considered a strong tornado in the mid-west tornado alley!

    Something has to change with the media's coining of that phrase, think I'll complain to the BBC for a start- who should know better!

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    Posted
  • Location: south London
  • Location: south London

    I watched a discovery programme and have it on tape to prove it....Europe have more tornadoes than USA....but are small in comparison and dont get reported

    that often and are often in remote rural areas

    another fact on my tape is that its just been discovered that lightning goes up intp space...Equivalent of the hieght of 10 Mount everests.Im not on about Sprites

    was on discovery last week....Just recently been discovered..I recorded it dont know if any one watched programme

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    Posted
  • Location: Tonyrefail (175m asl)
  • Location: Tonyrefail (175m asl)

    From looking at the damage, I’d say that was a powerful tornado, possibly measuring up to 2 or even 3 on the fujita scale. The term mini-tornado is ridiculous, it’s like calling a category 3 hurricane a mini-hurricane…. Absurd!

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    Posted
  • Location: marlow bucks
  • Location: marlow bucks

    After I read the update on Estofex yesterday, I watched the weather bulletins from TF1 and France 2 on line and was really surprised that no alerts were out for the area and they weren't even forcasting storms! The French TV bulletins only tend to cover overnight forecasts for anything unusual, but given the Estofex forecast, I was expecting at least the mention of a risk of something.

    There were a couple of reports on Meteociel last night of big storms in the area at about the right time, but I haven't been able to check the details this morning, as the search facility only goes back 9 hours. The storms seemed really localised, but intense, with one person reporting 50mm of rain (no timescale given) and I'm sure there was a report of a strike rate of 12 strikes per minute at one stage! From memory, they were around Cambrai / Valenciennes areas, posted around 10pm local time.

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    Posted
  • Location: Cambridgeshire Fens. 3m ASL
  • Location: Cambridgeshire Fens. 3m ASL
    I'm afraid it's the ingrained UK Media's perception that 'big' tornadoes don't happen in the UK and Europe and only occur in the USA. With 3 people killed, that would be considered a strong tornado in the mid-west tornado alley!

    Something has to change with the media's coining of that phrase, think I'll complain to the BBC for a start- who should know better!

    Have to agree with you there Nick. Strange really that they call them mini tornadoes when the media usually hype up weather events.

    I just sent the BBC website my comments about the use of the term Mini in Tornado reports.

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    Posted
  • Location: Colchester, Essex, UK (33m ASL)
  • Location: Colchester, Essex, UK (33m ASL)

    Three reported killed now..

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7540484.stm

    I am contacting the BBC too about the term "mini tornado" too, a tornado is a tornado, nothing more, nothing less.

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    Posted
  • Location: Colchester, Essex, UK (33m ASL)
  • Location: Colchester, Essex, UK (33m ASL)

    My comments to the BBC on this article.

    A tornado is a tornado, there is no term that I know of of "mini tornado" in meteorology. It gives a skewed view to readers that Europe does not get the types of tornado as seen in the US. Yes it does, although maybe not so often, many are as damaging, and many with large hail (30mm+), therefore why is a European supercell tornado classified as "mini" by yourselves when it is no different to any other experienced around the world?

    We are all perplexed on Net-Weather.TV as to why this mistake keeps being made even though it has been pointed out to yourselves before I believe.

    Please reply to the given email address.

    Many thanks

    Dave

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    Posted
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)

    Thanks for that SnowBear, will write something similar myself I think, as complaints in numbers seems to do the trick sometimes!

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    Posted
  • Location: Cambridgeshire Fens. 3m ASL
  • Location: Cambridgeshire Fens. 3m ASL
    My comments to the BBC on this article.

    My comments to them were on the same sort of lines.

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    Posted
  • Location: Stevenage Herts
  • Location: Stevenage Herts

    i think initially calling it a mini tornado was an insult to the families of the dead. Look at the devastation only a tornado can do that

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    Posted
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)

    Yes, looking at the photos of the damage: http://photos.lavoix.com/main.php?g2_itemId=42420

    ... one has to wonder is the word 'mini-tornado' appropriate anymore. Looks like a scene of tornado devastation straight out the mid-west!

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    Posted
  • Location: Hampton and Fairfield, Evesham , Worcestershire.
  • Weather Preferences: Love Weather, Hate the Spin and Lies to do with our Planets Climate.
  • Location: Hampton and Fairfield, Evesham , Worcestershire.

    Have to agree that "mini tornado" is a term what should not be used! How can you describe the devastation ,looking from those pics, and describe something like that as "mini"? :lol:

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    Posted
  • Location: Swansea - 60m ASL
  • Weather Preferences: Thunderstorms, Snow & Sunshine!
  • Location: Swansea - 60m ASL

    I have no idea how they could have used the term "Mini Tornado" for the devistation caused. Houses torn apart, cars tossed around and 3 lives lost, i see nothing at all "Mini" about that whatsoever.

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    Posted
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)

    Here's the tornado report on the ESWD (European severe weather database):

    tornado 

    Hautmont, Neuf-Mesnil, Maubeuge, Boussières-sur-Sambre Maubeuge->Boussiere, 3 morts, 40 maisons touchées, nombreux dégats. F3 supposé, Nord
    France (50.2500 N, 3.9333 E)
    03 08 2008 (Sunday) 22:00 UTC (+/- 3 hrs.)

    based on: information from a newspaper report, a report on a website, a television or radio broadcast, an eye-witness report, photo or video of the event, photograph(s) and/or video footage of the inflicted damage, a damage survey by a severe weather expert
    land use: land
    land use where event was first observed: land
    F3 the intensity rating was based on an eyewitness report of the damage, photograph(s) and/or video footage of the inflicted damage, a written account of the damage (e.g. in a newspaper).
    accompanying weather: heavy rain.
    damage to property: 40 hs de
    total damage: Plusieurs millions d
    number of people injured: 9
    number of people dead: 3
    A mini-tornado in the North made three dead and nine wounded 3 hours ago HAUTMONT (AFP) - Three people died and nine others were injured in the collapse of their houses, following a mini-tornado has caused extensive damage in the night from Sunday to Monday at Hautmont (North) and surrounding areas, according to a provisional toll of the North prefecture. The body of a deputy mayor of Hautmont and his wife were found Monday morning in the rubble of their homes to Hautmont, a few hours after the discovery of the body of an elderly woman, killed on the spot in the collapse his house, also in Hautmont. Nine people were injured, two seriously to Boussières-sur-Sambre, and were hospitalized, according to a provisional toll of the North prefecture. Nearly 200 firefighters and 50 police officers were mobilized throughout the night, and white plane, which provides for the mobilization of emergency services, was triggered, said the prefecture. Heavy rain and violent winds have caused extensive damage over a dozen kilometres to 23:00 Sunday, along an axis Maubeuge / Nine-Mesnil / Hautmont / Boussières-sur-Sambre. Hautmont, a city of 16,000 inhabitants south-east of the department of Nord, was the hardest hit, with a quarantine of houses severely damaged, according to the prefecture. Two streets were particularly affected. The roofs of the houses have disappeared, the brick walls have crumbled, and the road was strewn with rubble, plates, tiles and electrical cables, found an AFP journalist. Cars were overturned by the wind. "In my home, the roof is gone, all the windows are broken, the walls of the house of my neighbour are also broken", told AFP Leon Denoyelle, 75 years old, who lives in the street Fernand Roussel, the hardest hit by the mini-tornado. "In the street, there is no more roofs, shutters are gone, there's nothing that takes." A few kilometres away, Boussières-sur-Sambre, a house was completely destroyed and its two occupants seriously injured, were hospitalized. "There's nothing, everything had collapsed inside", told AFP a resident of the street, Stella Blandiau, joined by telephone. "I can not stay in my house, the walls and ceiling have moved, tiles and carpentry are parties," she explained. A Hautmont, the cultural centre of the city was open during the night. A dozen elderly people living alone or whose relatives were away on vacation, there are made, and several families, said a journalist from AFP. Volunteers of the Red Cross have distributed hot drinks, pastries, as well as clothing and blankets. "We believe host a thirty families, we prepare hot drinks and cookies", told AFP Marie-Jose Leroy, deputy mayor, joined by telephone. A chestnut tree was felled a few metres from his house. Part of the roof of the retirement home Hautmont, and a portion of the roof of the hospital in Maubeuge, were also damaged, according to the prefecture in the north. source2: NTV, 04.08.2008; http://www.n-tv.de/1003573.html
    This report has been partially verified.
    contact: musi12; (report expanded,T.Kühne) [e-mail]

    An F3 estimate, report I've translated using google translation into pigeon English/

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    Posted
  • Location: South Shields Tyne & Wear half mile from the coast.
  • Location: South Shields Tyne & Wear half mile from the coast.

    Having seen the footage i'd say that was a high end EF2 even possibly an EF3.

    Its high time the word 'mini' was dropped from describing weak tornadoes, a tornado

    is a tornado simple as that!!

    Always sad to hear of deaths caused by weather conditions....is time for Europe to

    have doppler radar? Scientists have stressed that these weather events will increase

    in strength and frequency if the earth continues to warm.

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    Posted
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)
  • Location: Caterham-on-the-hill, Surrey, 190m asl (home), Heathrow (work)

    I've heard whispers of the UK eventually getting nationwide doppler radar coverage, but some countries on the continent which have a higher incidence of severe weather should definately invest in doppler coverage i think.

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    Posted
  • Location: Left of centre off of the strip
  • Location: Left of centre off of the strip
    Have to agree with you there Nick. Strange really that they call them mini tornadoes when the media usually hype up weather events.

    I just sent the BBC website my comments about the use of the term Mini in Tornado reports.

    I think the do it simply because it annoys you guys so much :lol: :o :) :o :)

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    Posted
  • Location: Hampton and Fairfield, Evesham , Worcestershire.
  • Weather Preferences: Love Weather, Hate the Spin and Lies to do with our Planets Climate.
  • Location: Hampton and Fairfield, Evesham , Worcestershire.
    Having seen the footage i'd say that was a high end EF2 even possibly an EF3.

    Its high time the word 'mini' was dropped from describing weak tornadoes, a tornado

    is a tornado simple as that!!

    Always sad to hear of deaths caused by weather conditions....is time for Europe to

    have doppler radar? Scientists have stressed that these weather events will increase

    in strength and frequency if the earth continues to warm.

    These storms have always occured and unfortunately people die whatever we have ,doppler/ uptodate weather forecasts. I think the "problem" here today is more folks live on the planet and therefore storms effect more people, and secondly we would not of heard this incident years ago because there was not the commnication around, and these storms can literally come out of nowhere as Nick will verify and take us all by surprise, but thats the weather!

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    Posted
  • Location: Tonyrefail (175m asl)
  • Location: Tonyrefail (175m asl)

    I contacted the beeb earlier also regarding the term mini tornado, I believe they have altered the article now as well as the teletext report.

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