Chris Knight

The link to the figure is http://hadobs.metoffice.com/hadcet/graphs/stations2mean_2009.gif I arrived there via the hadobs hadCET diagnostics page. All three stations are currently showing flatlines, and why the 'data' is presented online I do not know. As to the deviations, the Metoffice are the people to ask, as Dev points out. This is what they would like us to believe is the current situation, link first, then image: http://hadobs.metoffice.com/hadcet/graphs/HadCET_act_graphEX.gif Frankly I think it is Cr*p, but who can say?

Remember Whitewash versus Dulux Brilliant White, Dev. And the commercial Stevenson Screens you can buy that are made of White coated steel (that somehow gave record high temperatures during summer heatwaves in 2003).

omigod!!!! Dev's flatlined too! Good, but is it feeding into the CET?, or are we just coasting along on the mean?

Thanks Dev, I am sure you will get to the bottom of it! I have answered your previous question satisfactorily I believe. I don't trust them on the basis that they continue to release sloppy information, as far as I am concerned. OK?

OK, here's the link to the three main stations that are supposed to supply the Hadley CET data in real time. None of them appear to be working at the moment, so where is the data coming from? Dev? Are you there?

Not a single one Dev, the trust is universal, and who can argue with that belief?

NASA/GISS just takes the figure from the Hadley CET to represent the whole of the UK doesn't it? Such trust.

This is what the hoo-hah is all about - raw historical station data that has then been corrected and adjusted by various algorithms to produce the Datasets that Professor Jones has used to produce papers that show there has been historical global warming. Steve McIntyre wants to see if he can reproduce those results, or if there are problems with the methodology. I think that recent data all falls under FOI legislation, and can be obtained from source if required. The data is a large text file, with station names and data laid out as in the first post. Here's a bit of the data, which will get all un formatted when posted 1904 3 -7 13 66 106 148 170 160 124 83 42 21 77 1905 -7 9 27 40 120 171 177 156 124 50 32 17 76 1906 7 7 15 68 132 170 172 165 135 94 69 -11 85 1907 -11 -9 20 55 106 135 158 144 124 118 37 6 74 26180 557 -132 73LUND SWEDEN 17531773 101753 1753 -18 -13 37 76 115 146 167 159 134 99 32 -30 75 1754 -10 -14 -12 56 129 152 151 155 119 101 47 19 74 1755 -38 -53 8 79 120 178 182 154 121 84 37 20 74 1756 19 23 25 42 99 176 194 156 141 92 18 -1 82 1757 -28 7 14 82 107 182 214 176 136 52 60 13 85 1758 -39 -20 7 33 139 167 160 168 118 67 45 10 71 1759 24 23 34 62 102 174 201 181 131 91 21 -20 85 1760 -40 -10 7 61 118 192 182 171 153 85 40 25 82 1761 6 12 50 68 129 180 173 183 152 63 51 -6 88 1762 11 -7 -18 81 115 170 174 142 124 48 41 5 74 1763 -39 5 5 46 112 149 178 169 115 77 28 30 73 1764 -1 30 14 56 125 136 205 163 118 76 24 1 79 1765 -3 -23 29 69 102 153 159 169 119 90 45 -2 76 1766 -18 -27 21 81 119 173 188 172 138 87 58 -9 82 1767 -61 -6 21 27 98 139 164 173 150 89 64 4 72 1768 -55 -31 -24 51 107 163 179 171 125 82 49 21 70 1769 6 -5 23 57 113 156 176 159 136 52 26 32 78 1770 -23 0 -29 45 115 151 181 181 154 105 25 15 77 1771 -38 -38 -39 22 124 180 172 151 125 101 28 25 68 1772 -16 -21 -11 47 100 162 178 171 136 110 72 29 80 1773 10 -9 16 73 141 159 181 180 145 112 50 26 90 28070 686 -274 -999IVALO FINLAND 19611970 101961 1961 -107 -110 -65 -43 34 131 148 119 66 52 -35 -150 3 1962 -158 -111 -145 -5 32 89 109 92 56 2 -23 -153 -18 1963 -146 -158 -131 -11 110 84 123 118 86 16 -71 -114 -8 1964 -64 -146 -68 -30 49 100 142 106 50 29 -77 -104 -1 1965 -134 -110 -107 -15 12 100 108 101 65 -5 -99 -149 -19 1966 -189 -231 -163 -43 34 120 145 101 34 -32 -35 -104 -30 1967 -181 -88 -38 -7 46 105 137 132 82 -4 -7 -174 0 It's the same data, but presented without decimal points, i.e. as tenths of a degree. McIntyre has this file, no doubt the will be doing a comparison.

I doubt it, the file name cruwlda2 was mentioned by Doug Hoyt, he said it was zipped at about 3.6Mb here, so I went fishing with my friend Google, found the gegereka site with the link then did a little FTPing and a reverse IP lookup to find out it is a CRU site, with some research data available by anonymous FTP. I'd bet it has been around for ages, but interesting how long it will remain available now. Of course I have a copy, should it disappear...

The data is apparently available online from CRU at the Tiempo Climate Cyberlibrary ftp://www.tiempocyberclimate.org/projects/advance10k/cruwlda2.zip

Hmm... feedbacks are tricky little blighters to pin down.

Then 'something' must stop the process from running away - since it doesn't get hotter and hotter, each time there is less cloud and a warmer ocean, what is it that stops the positive feedback?

It is still chicken or egg. Warm oceans -> less cloud, or less cloud -> warm oceans? Correlation is not cause and effect.

You're fact, I'm fact, in fact, we're all fact! and that's a fact!

Just mopped my kitchen dry from the last downpour. The lightning has just ceased being continuous. 3mm more to be wet for a week! How the uplanders moan!

My understanding is that coral atolls are always witin a few metres of sea level by nature. Ancient, extinct ocean volcanoes erode, and shallow water coral species colonise the submerged fringes of the island. Eventually the volcano erodes away completely, leaving a shallow lagoon surrounded by coral islands. Living, atoll-building coral is only present in the top few metres of tropical seas, requiring sunlight, but not too much UV, and just cool enough water temperatures to ensure that the coral polyps are the dominant organism. The living coral is neither submerged too deep, nor exposed by tidal action. Diminishing sea levels, or rising sea beds expose the reefs, the exposed corals die, and erosion takes place, creating sand and a habitat for water-, air-, and animal-borne plant seeds and spores to germinate. Sand binds together with roots of vegetation and rain produces freshwater water tables. Wind and tides build up more sand, birds and rafted animals occupy the various ecological niches. Coral eaters, such as parrot fish, produce even more sand, and occasional storms and tsunamis both strip away and deposit more debris on the islands. Eventually man discovers the island, and settles there. If the island provides enough for a large population to develop such as in Tuvalu, the balance between people and nature becomes even more precarious. Freshwater aquifers are overdrawn, and become brackish or saline. Sand is used to produce concrete for roads, sea defences, and buildings, and the physical structure of the islands becomes more prone to erosion. Pollution and overfishing kills the local corals, and rapidly the source of the replenishing coral sand disappears, and in time the islands die, and disappear into the ocean.

Looks like the new invasive ladybird species, the Harlequin Ladybird, which may be instrumental in forcing out several native British species.

About the greatest number of storms in one day in the last six years for Worthing. Three this afternoon, however none was spectacular. Storms from the south rarely seem to strike here, usually passing to the east. Todays north-westerly approach worked well though!

Splendid! Well done John and Paul

Sounds like a small Japanese scooter

It appears that the cloud in the earlier image obscured most of the features of interest in the later one. I agree that the leads are extensive though, in the area where the ice pack is the oldest, and potentially thickest. If you look through the gaps in the clouds of the earlier image, the leads were already there:

If you consider that all journeys begin at "home", and end back at "home" at some point in the future, then the baseline is always "home". No matter what form the journey took, how long or far. Is that an equilibrium, or a position of rest?

The Journal "Science" seems to have given up Darwinism in favour of Lamarckism, if this is the case. Whatever next: Creationism?

Cracking display this morning from about 0315 from Portsmouth, until the sky got too bright. Handheld photo taken about 0335:

Currently, Lat 87.428 Lon -0.848, last year, at the same date and hour, Lat 86.303 Lon -2.292, Songster, so just a degree or so difference.