Red Raven

the weather in the lakes hasn't been as bad as everywhere else hence my tropical temp of 28.2 11th June, in contrast this month has only reached 22.5 lower than both april and may.

I agree too. Cumbrians stand togther united against ignorance - oh hang on PP's in Cumbria too! Oh oon ID is that dreadful police state card thingy the government wants to make us all carry.

You might have discussed the tail bone but your explanation is rather poor to say the least. Its like saying we evolved a torso to keep the brain in. Yep newts maybe at a disadvantage but evolution doesn't mean the best solution is found ....or was it god that made a bit of a balls up - certainly not so intelligent there! :wacko:

How do you explain the remnants of a tail in every human? How do you explain the existace of the newt that has legs that are gradually (through the process of evolution) turning to fins? Evidence (imperical and measuarable evidence) is everywhere. There is no evidence of any kind that inteligent design is at work.

As I think Mr Plank has clearly won the argument I am prepared to stand shoulder to shoulder with VP and will fight any such ban should it be deemed necessary by the great NW creator.

i wish more people would.

Plant more trees. Yes the effect is slow in human terms but the planet is old and in those timescales the effect is instant. I think we should go further and allow a volantary extra to be paid alongide our subscription into a kitty which can go towards planting the NW 'bring back cold winters' wood.

Comparing the findings of the past 'warm' greenland with now must be done with caution. Not least because of the huge variation in altitude. As was pointed out earlier during this warmer period the ice at the centre of the land mass was 0.5 - 1 km less than now - that will make a big difference to the ability of Greenland to retain cold and be a big driver of the surrounding weather patterns. I'm not sure but I think i remember correctly that for every 100mm rise a fall off of 0.3 deg C occurs and at Greenland lattitudes the fall off must be more pronounced. So basically what I'm saying is Greenland has at some stage reached its own tiping point and gained enough ice cover to be a climate driver and not just a weather influencer. Yes the earth was much warmer but what we are seeing now is not comparable with the past. The result may be the same, the outcome may be not as devastating as predicted, but change is happening and we should assume that our effects are the driver of that change and we should act accordingly - the gamble is simply not worth it.

Found a link http://www.caithness.org/history/articles/...onaldsaysheep2/ where's edit gone? - found it but its not on the one above!

I will have to let someone else provide the evidence as there others that are far more adept at the complex subject. But, I remember watching a programme on the BBC last year (it may have been Coast) and they reported on the strange seaweed eating sheep on an island (somewhere in Scotland I think). Due to the lord of the manner not wanting sheep on his land they were forced to forage on the beaches and tidal zones and eat what grass they could find, most of the grass was provided by the farmer. However over a period of only 100 years these sheep (or their offspring) evolved to be able to digest seaweed and the subsequent high levels of salt. These sheep now cannot eat grass without risking death - is this not evolution at work responding to a chaotic random situation and making the best of whats available?

No god doesn't exist or is he the mutant - i get confused.

naughty naughty OON we should be supportive of our fellow cumbrian and his philosphy even if the grounds for the theory of intelligent design is well ... not very intelligent. PP show us we are wrong and present some evidence for the theory. At the moment it's just a faith.

Now that is a silly argument. And quite frankly a rather arrogant one. If Darwinian theory is based on pure conjecture then what is Intelligent Design based on?

erm... Dawkins and the selfish gene! a mother protects not simply because of the love and care she has for her child but because there is an overiding imperative that that gene pool must succeed and carry on reproducing. If that is not the case then why in the anaimal world does infanticide occur?

That reminds me of a conversation i had a long time ago with my research supervisor (who was a life long atheist and anarchist) about the irony of revolution as a means by which to free the people from the yoke of control. Whilst some, probably most, would welcome the freedom, but forcing freedom on all somewhat undermines the notion of true liberty. The revolutionary chant was then amended from "You will be Free" to "You will be Free, if that's what you want". A version of the same argument can be applied to the notion of a selfless creation of life. Some may be very grateful for the gift of life, but others would rather not have it. And unless the apprecaition of that gift is unanimous it cannot be anything other than a selfish passtime of the 'creator'.

Jan: 134.8mm Feb: 52.8 Mar: 91.5 Apr: 35.2 May: 84.4 June: 116 (3.5 hours of the month left) Total: 514.6mm (oon you're beating me!) OON are your figures right?

What could be more selfish than a 'designer' deciding to create life? If that is how life came about then it was either done on a "whim" or for some other purpose which cannot be said to be altruistic.

Simple question then. Why is the design not perfect?

I would agree with that. What strikes me as grossly arrogant is the belief that life, with humans seen as the greatest example of achievement in the 'grand design', as so special. To believe that 'we' can only have happened if the hand of some great controller created us shows arrogance and lack of confidence in the species as a whole. If im wrong and there is a designer at work then if i ever get the chance to meet them the first thing i would do is punch them in the face for all the untold (and unecessary) suffering that has existed for the whole of history. And then seek to over throw the genocidal b*****.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/6736687.stm It sounds pretty bad. The bbc are reporting at least 5 killed and suspect the number to rise!

Hottest day of the year here - 25.1

Can you name some sources for the claim, ive not heard any such theories. ta very much

and all this was meadow lat week http://www.val-gardena.com/eng/page208.html

Ive had 35.2mm but that is short of the expected. quite a difference from last december when i had 215mm. Total for the year so far is 314.2mm

yes it was a warm winter here too. I had more frosts but a lot less than the previous year. 2006/07 winter - 21 air frosts, season mean - 5.9 (1.8 above 30yr mean) 2005/06 winter - 38 air frosts, season mean - 4.3 (0.2 above 30yr mean)