BBC Weather Forecasts and Graphics Discussion

[A Gower Guy]

Slightly off topic, but have temperatures in a circle gone out of fashion , as Sky now also use squares rather than circles, just a thought

[J10]

Having disappeared a few weeks ago (and been replaced by a smoother moving graphic) I noticed that the 'jumping' rainband had returned on today's 08.50 Breakfast forecast .

The band jumped from Ireland to East Wales leaving West Wales (the most rain prone region) without rain shown moving over it !

Who is complaining, I'd be quite happy for the rain to jump from Ireland to East Wales.

I would be happy though if the resolution up to 24 hours could be extended at least until 48 hours.

[kold weather]

Hi Jackone,they do extend upto 48hrs,generally though at night-time they only show about 30hrs of high resoultion stuff before going back to lower stuff.

[i luv snow]

yea, i liked those big wind arrows showing the storm area too- and te forecast on bbc news 24 earlier by Sir Rob was legendary!! a wink, excited and surprised expressions, a bit of a moan at the temps, some rhetoric questions and even a little finger point, amongst others!! lol

[Microburst]

Hahahahaha - we used to get magnetic symbols falling off a map, and now you get complaints that the computer animation isn't quite as smooth as it could be.

Do you ever wonder why you bother?!!

Many times OON, especially trying to explain things on here!

to Micro

'Do you ever wonder why you bother?!!'

sums up some of the posts on here!

Most of us are quite pleased with much of what is now done. Sure there is room for improvement with some graphics, but it certainly is one heck of a sight better than it was at the beginning. Just a shame that more consultation with people who care did not happen before you went live.

regards

John

I'm sure that Ian, Bill, John and most of the others would have enjoyed 'playing' with these new graphics.

I think Ian swore more about the then graphics than anything else if you chatted to him about doing TV forecasts!

j

You win some and you lose some John - one thing I have learned from 20 something years at the BBC!! Problems and aggro surrounding the changes to the weather graphics are relatively minor compared to explaining to 'joe public' and answering questions now on switching off analogue television transmissions and going digital.

Overall I like the 16-5-05 onwards graphics, as previously said by some other members, the forecasts are generally more accurate.

The changes over the last few weeks have increased the pleasure of watching the forecast, with the weather warning caption in the bottom right and zooming into the affected area(s), the radar style movement of the rain across the country, and the lightning effects on thundery showers.

The wind arrows for me move to fast (the paper aeroplane looking ones), if they moved at a steadier speed like the old ones or at speeds similar to strength, fast when windy slow when a little breezy, then that would benefit the forecasts.

Also there does need to be more showing of the temperature colour map or more temperature squares on the map. The one good thing with the temperatures with this system is the squares colour represents the temperature better than the 0, 10, 25 did.

Good points Button04 will pass them on for you tomorrow

Slightly off topic, but have temperatures in a circle gone out of fashion , as Sky now also use squares rather than circles, just a thought

The BBC changed to temperature numbers within squares so as not to confuse wind speeds in circles. A common complaint with the old system.

MB

Who is complaining, I'd be quite happy for the rain to jump from Ireland to East Wales.

I would be happy though if the resolution up to 24 hours could be extended at least until 48 hours.

Keep watching Jackone!

[shuggee]

I like the new silvery shading indicating frost. It's quite an unusual colouring - but seems to suit

[Kent Snow]

First time I've seen the silver shading tonight too and it I think its a fair representation of a frost.

[chris55]

I still don't really think that the new system is as good as the old and it never can be, however I have seen some good things starting to apeer on the new system and if the forecaster is a bit imaginitive then the forecasts can be informatie and a pleasure to watch.

The other day hellen willets, from a distance, zoomed into a synoptic chart showing a deep low pressure over scotland then issued a pop up weather warning with the zoomed chart behind. Which i thought worked well and showed the situation well. Where as the same day another forecaster simply said it will be windy in the north and showed the l rain/shadow map to illistrate this (no wind animation) wich was not very inmormative or pleasing to watch. So if used well the graphics can be made better.

The new wind arrows are better than the litlle white flashing ones buit if you compare them to the old ones I really don't think anyone could say they are "clearer" or "easier to understand" than the old ones.

Frost looks good though and i like the way it moves around with the clear skies.

As people have said the resalution beyod 24/36 hors is so bad that I think they are hardly worth using at all. And I notice that alot of forecasters don't use them and simply put up the summary boxes and city names for days 2/3/4. I think this is a major flaw in the whole system and the fact that you can't get a decent forecast past 36 hours frustrates people the most. I think this is the reason people are most upset with the new graphics. If this problem is delt with and the system can be used to forecast well beyond 36 hours in detail this would be the improvment the system really needs.

I know the BBC used to get lots of awards for the old system and rightly so. However I will be interested to see how the new graphics compare in this respect. In my opinion they will not do very well and I dont think they deserve an award for to many reasons to go into, a lot of them have been discussed before though.

Any way just my latest thought on the weather graphics and ill probably pass them on to BBC.

.

[Andy Bown]

When Microburst reads this - I'm being +ive .

The new frost graphic is excellent !

I think it would be even better with a few temp symbols over the top of it, normally the cities which I would take a few degrees off of for my sheltered country location.

[Kent Snow]

Just watched the latest 16.57 BBC News 24 forecast with Peter Gibbs and for the first time I saw little arrows within the HIGH and LOW pressures indication the flow/circulation of air. Hope we see more of this as it's a great addition.

[J10]

I think perhaps now we are starting to see the forecasters getting to grips with the system and we are starting to see the real potential of the system.

I quite like the frost graphic and I get the feeling there is still a lot to come from these graphics.

[Microburst]

When Microburst reads this - I'm being +ive .

The new frost graphic is excellent !

I think it would be even better with a few temp symbols over the top of it, normally the cities which I would take a few degrees off of for my sheltered country location.

Hi Andy,

Glad you approve of the frost graphic and yes, I think you will find that temperature numbers will still be used in conjuction with the pic graphics where necessary.

MB

Just watched the latest 16.57 BBC News 24 forecast with Peter Gibbs and for the first time I saw little arrows within the HIGH and LOW pressures indication the flow/circulation of air. Hope we see more of this as it's a great addition.

Keep watching ES, there is more to come. As I mentioned a few posts ago, tests and experiments are being carried out at the moment with the new graphics system, (not with the presenters!) .... so you will see a few more symbols appearing and disappearing as the weeks go by. Now that the software has been in place for nearly six months and people have got the general jist of the new system, ways of enhancing the national maps are currently being looked at. Keep watching MB

[Thundery wintry showers]

Well, I say keep up what is being done- changes to the system in recent weeks have been strongly positive and are genuinely bringing about improvements.

[Terminal Moraine]

I agree with TWS.

My initial response to the graphics was one of horror but there have been gradual improvements over the last few months and the current situation is a much brighter one, albeit not perfect.

We now have pressure maps in most forecasts, there are symbols for thunderstorms and frost, wind arrows have been added and the orientation of the map has been altered for the better.

On the downside I would like to see the outlook given with the pressure map as a background and do away with the block symbols for three or four selected cities. Unless you actually live in the cities concerned you would need to have a good deal of meteorological nous to extrapolate the data and relate it to your own particular area; in most cases it would be an impossible task.

Even to the general public I suggest it would be a much more meaningful outlook to have the forecaster giving an overview of the likely movement of rain bearing systems, wind direction and general temperature on a pressure map of the British Isles and surrounding area.

As a general example of the shortcomings of the current outlook; if I am given Glasgow with a rain symbol, Manchester with a cloud symbol, Cardiff with a rain symbol and London with a cloud and sun symbol, how do I relate this information as to the likely conditions at over 300m in the Peak District?

It could be cloudy and dry, there could be rain moving in from the west which will never reach here, there could be rain moving in which will eventually get here, it could be cloudy at first and brighten later.

Someone will undoubtedly tell me that there isn't enough time to give a proper outlook but don't get me started on that topic.

T.M

[J10]

I agree with TM, the longer term is the aspect of the forecast which is the weakest, maybe an old fashioned use of symbols on the maps could be used for a longer term outlook.

[shuggee]

Just watched the latest 16.57 BBC News 24 forecast with Peter Gibbs and for the first time I saw little arrows within the HIGH and LOW pressures indication the flow/circulation of air. Hope we see more of this as it's a great addition.

There seem to be two versions of this. I saw News24 earlier - and yes they show the circulations with arrows. However, on BBC1 Scotland tonight, the national forecast used moving chevrons on the Atlantic synoptic chart - which were even better and different colours! Very interesting developments - makes tuning in wothwhile atm, just to see the latest gadgetry in action (or is that a wee bit sad? )

Edited November 14, 2005 by shuggee

[Mr Cumulo Nimbus]

Just watched the latest 16.57 BBC News 24 forecast with Peter Gibbs and for the first time I saw little arrows within the HIGH and LOW pressures indication the flow/circulation of air. Hope we see more of this as it's a great addition.

Dan Corbett used them as well in his excellent 10:35 forecast this evening, they looked pretty good.

In more general terms, tonight's 10:35 forecast was an excellent one - not one but TWO animated synoptics for Wednesday and Thursday. The first one had the wind circulation arrows depicting the northerly wind and Dan talked about a "weather disturbance" which is bringing the showers in on the east coast. The second chart showed high pressure building in to give the clear, cool weather expected for Thursday.

Meanwhile, the flyover was used sensibly (not just flying around the whole country) to show on the area where the weather is interesting, in this case the wintry showers in northern Scotland and the Northern Isles, and these wintry showers showed up very clearly on the graphics. Indeed, even on the lower-scale graphics for the outlook period the wintry showers showed up quite well running in on the East coast.

An excellent forecast, and one that is representative of many of the excellent forecasts being put out by the BBC over recent weeks. The graphics really have been improved recently, and they're now looking really good. The one problem is that so much depends on the presenter, some use the charts effectively while others seem to use them less effectively.

On another point, (perhaps Microburst can answer this) is Dan going to be a regular feature on the 10:35 or is this a one-off appearance? If it's a regular thing, then great, a breath of fresh air to the forecasts!

[Microburst]

Dan Corbett used them as well in his excellent 10:35 forecast this evening, they looked pretty good.

In more general terms, tonight's 10:35 forecast was an excellent one - not one but TWO animated synoptics for Wednesday and Thursday. The first one had the wind circulation arrows depicting the northerly wind and Dan talked about a "weather disturbance" which is bringing the showers in on the east coast. The second chart showed high pressure building in to give the clear, cool weather expected for Thursday.

Meanwhile, the flyover was used sensibly (not just flying around the whole country) to show on the area where the weather is interesting, in this case the wintry showers in northern Scotland and the Northern Isles, and these wintry showers showed up very clearly on the graphics. Indeed, even on the lower-scale graphics for the outlook period the wintry showers showed up quite well running in on the East coast.

An excellent forecast, and one that is representative of many of the excellent forecasts being put out by the BBC over recent weeks. The graphics really have been improved recently, and they're now looking really good. The one problem is that so much depends on the presenter, some use the charts effectively while others seem to use them less effectively.

On another point, (perhaps Microburst can answer this) is Dan going to be a regular feature on the 10:35 or is this a one-off appearance? If it's a regular thing, then great, a breath of fresh air to the forecasts!

Howdo Mr CN.... BBC Weather currently use 16 national weather presenters over 11 radio and television channels, daily. Recently the pack was given a 'shake' to introduce more faces and there are 2 more new faces yet to be seen, still in training. It is very possible Dan will be seen again at the 2235 slot.

Hope this answers your question.

MB

Edited November 15, 2005 by Microburst

[i luv snow]

i like that new Matt guy, quite young with a hint of a welsh accent- always find his forecasts interesting, and no Oz it IS his presenting technique that draws me to his forecasts, nothing else

i saw the little moving arrows inside the High and Low Pressure charts- top class! I like that touch! I have ALWAYS loved these new graphics, and they just get better and better

[Microburst]

i like that new Matt guy, quite young with a hint of a welsh accent- always find his forecasts interesting, and no Oz it IS his presenting technique that draws me to his forecasts, nothing else

i saw the little moving arrows inside the High and Low Pressure charts- top class! I like that touch! I have ALWAYS loved these new graphics, and they just get better and better

Just for you ILS i have found Matt's BBC profile for you

http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/bbcweather/fo...aylor_faq.shtml

MB

[Veritas]

BBC Weather currently use 16 national weather presenters over 11 radio and television channels, daily. Recently the pack was given a 'shake' to introduce more faces and there are 2 more new faces yet to be seen, still in training.

MB

Hi

Counting the biogs on the weather site shows around 21 people on the national team, and I haven't seen any new faces in the pack lately.

Who are the new ones yet to be seen, where have they come from and who are the replacing?

Edited November 17, 2005 by Veritas

[Great Plum]

I like the guy who seems a bit of an eccentirc - is it Dan Corbett...

Yesterday he said: "Today will be one of those days where you step outside and say ooo, it's cold and then you go back and get your thick coat..."

He also calls the temps 'numbers' and says things like 'good day for a picnic' and remember to take your umbrella! lol

[i luv snow]

yea Dan Corbett is good too! Very eccentric, i like that in a good presenter. Of course he aint as good as the best eccentric, Sir Rob!!!

Thanks MB for finding Matts profile, a top presenter of the future i reckon! (and already imo of course!)

[Microburst]

Hi

Counting the biogs on the weather site shows around 21 people on the national team, and I haven't seen any new faces in the pack lately.

Who are the new ones yet to be seen, where have they come from and who are the replacing?

A few of the people on the biogs page are no longer with BBC Weather for various reasons or are on attatchments elsewhere. The new faces (and I cannot tell you who they are yet) will be replacing Helen Young, Sarah Wilmshurst and Mike Fish. Keep an eye the Met Office pages and BBC Weather pages for more details next year.

MB

I like the guy who seems a bit of an eccentirc - is it Dan Corbett...

Yesterday he said: "Today will be one of those days where you step outside and say ooo, it's cold and then you go back and get your thick coat..."

He also calls the temps 'numbers' and says things like 'good day for a picnic' and remember to take your umbrella! lol

I would not say Dan is eccentric but he has a very witty sense of humour and is great fun. Having spent a good deal of time in the USA presenting weather there, he has picked up and developed a lot of 'sayings' which are unique to his presenting style.

MB

[Can't change the weather]

I don't like these new BBC maps at all. Even going back to sticking the symbols on the maps would be better!

For a lot of you guys who are really into the detail it's probably great.

Most people just want to see what the weather will be at a glance though. They don't want to have to concentrate too hard, which you have to with these maps. Maybe I'll get used to them but at present I find them annoying, worse than the ones before and a waste of public money.