Have You Noticed The Reduction In Daylight Hours Yet ?

[Essan]

Absolutely true. Its horrible trying to get up in darkness. But despite the clock move that problem returns in a matter of a couple of weeks later anyway so little is gained.

Likewise the light evening argument!

Anyway, surely the main point is that once we're back on GMT we get model output an hour 'earlier'? Why anyone would want to wait longer than necessary to see it beats me!

[laserguy]

You don't loose any light - its just thrown onto the mornings instead!

I'm still to hear a good reason to go to GMT...

Ye I know - but most folk are still in bed long before it gets light so it goes unnoticed - unlike the sudden disappearance of that hour's daylight in the afternoon/evening. Ah, getting dark at 1530-1600 is great!

[syed2878]

i think we should put the clocks 2h forward in summer and just 1h back in w.months. That could possibley work.

[Norway Nut]

Well, I for one have noticed the evenings drawing in! In summer, here in Western Norway, it doesn't really get dark and now? It's dark by 7 and doesn't really lighten until after 8:30 Looking forward to Christmas when the days start lengthing out from daylight from around 9:45 to dark by 3:30. Overall the difference between daylight in summer and daylight in winter is about 18 hours.

[Wynn D Woo]

A fair few haven't noticed yet, going by the number of idiots in the morning and evening commute, driving on the motorway with no lights at all

[Snowy Easterlies]

i think even those dimwits from The only way is Essex have noticed the difference in daylight hours by now,

i understand some on here won't have a clue who im talking about

[Methuselah]

i think we should put the clocks 2h forward in summer and just 1h back in w.months. That could possibley work.

But, after 12 years' doing that, we'd all be working nights...

[I remember Atlantic 252]

lighter earlier in mornings from Sunday, like going back to late Aug, lightwise

[Isolated Frost]

I like waking up in the dark, personal preference I guess. Waking in harmony with the sunrise is really nice sometimes as well.

[Jax]

IMHO if you "tweak" the time/clocks you can also "tweak" your life for that time, it *is* the same thing, time is not altered, you shift your day by an hour.

But more so it less affects the many that work outside of the 9-5 style work pattern, and there is a lot more of them now.

Think we should just accept the standard time and if the "individual" wants it different, then "they" can adapt to what they want, rather than the mass being forced to accept the will of the fewer (not minority), just adapt to what nature gives, because for all our attempts we cannot change the sun and the earth, we still get reduced daylight and consequencly more daylight as the seasons change, we cannot change that only in our minds.

hope that mad ramble makes sense?

Edited October 25, 2012 by Jax

[Bottesford]

Agree Jax - if I could choose I'd follow my own patterns - which in summer would be full of 'jump up and get on with it' and winter more 'lets sleep another hour' then I would - exactly how my budgies run their life!

But we must follow how our society runs as a whole which sadly means running against our natural instinct to 'stop' in winter and to 'go like mad' in summer. The natural world runs at full pelt in summer making the most of available resources then slows or even stops down in winter. Us humans have short circuited that by running to much the same routine all year by using the thing we call 'time'.

The main reason I go on about clock move is that most of us *have* to be at work by 8:30am (for example) and *have* to stay till 5pm so no amount of "you should get up early to make the most of the light" or "work your life around zulu time" will actually help. Whereas moving the clocks in favour of us getting to leave work in the light would help....

It's almost similar how a bank holiday beats a chosen day off work because on a bank holiday everyone stops then when you go back to work afterwards there isn't a pile of crap on your desk from everyone else who worked that day. It's easier to move with the flock....

[Jax]

Agree Jax - if I could choose I'd follow my own patterns - which in summer would be full of 'jump up and get on with it' and winter more 'lets sleep another hour' then I would - exactly how my budgies run their life!

But we must follow how our society runs as a whole which sadly means running against our natural instinct to 'stop' in winter and to 'go like mad' in summer. The natural world runs at full pelt in summer making the most of available resources then slows or even stops down in winter. Us humans have short circuited that by running to much the same routine all year by using the thing we call 'time'.

The main reason I go on about clock move is that most of us *have* to be at work by 8:30am (for example) and *have* to stay till 5pm so no amount of "you should get up early to make the most of the light" or "work your life around zulu time" will actually help. Whereas moving the clocks in favour of us getting to leave work in the light would help....

It's almost similar how a bank holiday beats a chosen day off work because on a bank holiday everyone stops then when you go back to work afterwards there isn't a pile of crap on your desk from everyone else who worked that day. It's easier to move with the flock....

To me it really is a case of "why fight what you cannot fight", so why try and change *time* instead, nothing changes except you, but by that same token you have made the change for it (time). It does seem odd that we [as a whole] do this as I understand it the practice was brought in to help the farmers, but I may be wrong. It still gets light and dark when it does, so why faff around with it? I say accept it and move on.

[wizard.muh]

Agree Jax - if I could choose I'd follow my own patterns - which in summer would be full of 'jump up and get on with it' and winter more 'lets sleep another hour' then I would - exactly how my budgies run their life!

But we must follow how our society runs as a whole which sadly means running against our natural instinct to 'stop' in winter and to 'go like mad' in summer. The natural world runs at full pelt in summer making the most of available resources then slows or even stops down in winter. Us humans have short circuited that by running to much the same routine all year by using the thing we call 'time'.

The main reason I go on about clock move is that most of us *have* to be at work by 8:30am (for example) and *have* to stay till 5pm so no amount of "you should get up early to make the most of the light" or "work your life around zulu time" will actually help. Whereas moving the clocks in favour of us getting to leave work in the light would help....

It's almost similar how a bank holiday beats a chosen day off work because on a bank holiday everyone stops then when you go back to work afterwards there isn't a pile of crap on your desk from everyone else who worked that day. It's easier to move with the flock....

yes!!

[Coast]

Well despite the clocks changing I still had to get up in darkness and had the lights on during the full journey into work, so apart from the sort of hours extra lay-in, nothing has really changed in my dark World

Edited October 29, 2012 by Coast

[Bottesford]

Well it was at least daylight when I got up this morning although a lot of this is down to the weather itself with last week so extremely dull & cloudy.

But sunset is just after half 4 today and the schools comes back from half term and the tram works are in full swing all over west Nottingham - it's gonna be a 'fun' evening commute for all.

[Weather-history]

It's the safety and energy efficiency aspect - there are more people up & about at 6pm than there are 7am so its better to have the daylight hours skewed to towards the latter part of the day.

And it would still be dark at 6pm even if we stick to BST all year! It was going dark before we turned the clocks back at 6pm anyway. So what's the point?

[Great Plum]

I think what you need Bottesford is a job with annualised hours!

I quite like the clocks going back - it seems more Wintery and without it, even down south, it would be dark at 8 in the morning in December!

[Weather-history]

Thought I already had but shall summarise:

- More people are awake doing things in the afternoon/evenings than in the mornings so this leads to:

- Safer journeys.

- Lower energy use.

- People seem to prefer finishing work in daylight as it makes it seem like there's some day left.

- Most people leave for work in darkness anyway so why not put more of this darkness into the working day giving some light once you

For Manchester, the sunset time is currently about 4.40pm, it was 5.40pm before the clock changes back. How is that going to make a difference, it is still going to get dark at 6pm anyway, so how will it make much difference? you can't really make much use of the hour. What dictates people's outdoor activities is the weather not light.

And how will it mean lower energy usage? Peak energy usage I suspect is the evening when it will be dark anyway?

A lot of people don't work 9 to 5, they work shift work, how will it benefit them? How will your last argument benefit say someone who is on a 2pm to 10pm shift?

[Wilks]

I'm not too bothered in the winter as I think it makes little difference but I'm all for having GMT+2 during the summer months, that would be ideal!

[laserguy]

A lot of people don't work 9 to 5, they work shift work, how will it benefit them? How will your last argument benefit say someone who is on a 2pm to 10pm shift?

Ye - I work all hours under the sun and moon, and to be honest I don't know whether I'm coming or going,half the time. Folk who have a set working routine really ought to manage their time better! That 2pm - 10pm shift is absolutely horrendous and I give it up and swap someone for their night-shift if at all possible!

[Methuselah]

And it would still be dark at 6pm even if we stick to BST all year! It was going dark before we turned the clocks back at 6pm anyway. So what's the point?

Equally perhaps, why bother with pointless twice-yearly malarkey?

[Bottesford]

For Manchester, the sunset time is currently about 4.40pm, it was 5.40pm before the clock changes back. How is that going to make a difference, it is still going to get dark at 6pm anyway, so how will it make much difference? you can't really make much use of the hour. What dictates people's outdoor activities is the weather not light.

And how will it mean lower energy usage? Peak energy usage I suspect is the evening when it will be dark anyway?

A lot of people don't work 9 to 5, they work shift work, how will it benefit them? How will your last argument benefit say someone who is on a 2pm to 10pm shift?

The difference between 5pm and 6pm darkness is quite significant for many people who do work 9-5 and of course for kids coming back from school finishing at 4ish. If we stay on BST I would only need to cycle home in true darkness for two months (of which 1.5 weeks is the christmas break anyway). This makes a huge difference to feeling of safety in the rush hour. Sure it was getting dim by half 5 before and I was putting my lights on anyway but I could still see things like broken glass, students aimlessly wandering onto the cycle path etc. Now it will be true darkness which is much worse. When its dark there's an element of 'hope' as to what you're riding over and this time of year with all the autumn debris it can be dangerous or just annoying when you get another puncture.

Last week I could get home and not put the lights on straight away. I could perform maintenance on my bike, check the garden, sweep up the leaves, etc. Now this must wait for the weekend.

Energy use - Like I say, no lights needed when I got in (admittedly briefly) but now they'll all be straight on. I admit the benefit will be rapidly lost at this time of year and agree staying on BST now would only provide a 2-3 weeks at very most of evening improvement. The real benefit would be felt in mid-late Feb and most of March when it gets lighter again but we wait a long time to recover that evening light and thus continue to use more energy than we would if we'd gone back to BST.

Shift workers - well by the very nature of the work you're out of sync with the majority so you have to accept it. Most people don't work 2pm-10pm anymore than people work 6am-2pm - most work in the middle of that range so we need the light to suit the majority.

[laserguy]

Shift workers - well by the very nature of the work you're out of sync with the majority so you have to accept it. Most people don't work 2pm-10pm anymore than people work 6am-2pm - most work in the middle of that range so we need the light to suit the majority.

Botte' if it bothers you that much you're just going to have to bite the bullet and find another job! How about milkman?

[Bottesford]

To be honest I'm ok as I can charge up on daylight in my office. I face directly south with a large window so if its sunny I get it right in the face from 10am-sunset (Nov-Jan). This of course brings its own issues.. We want the light/warmth in but prefer to avoid blindness. My solution is to have panels of card blu-takked to the window in a strategic curve pattern following the track of the sun. I adjust these throughout the 'blinding' season (late Aug-early April) and everyone thinks I'm mad. And they'd be right... but I can still see and I get sun!

[Aaron]

Moan moan moan, here's an idea to people who start cutting themselves as the prospect of reduced daylight hours - find a hobby, occupy your mind, that is what ordinary people do.