when is the expected time for air to get pleasant again?

[Tony27]

nice day today at 19c but its not brilliant for september or anything notable at all

[cheese]

17C today, which is nothing special for the time of year.

If you sat in a room at 18c you would begin to feel chilly after a while.

So what? I would find 15C indoors in January to be chilly but would find it very mild outside.

[matty007]

nice day today at 19c but its not brilliant for september or anything notable at all

 

Given that the average temperature for September is 14c it is pretty decent, obviously not extraordinary or particularly special though. Could be a lot worse. 

 

You've also got to look at where you're situated, some places are reaching 22c, many a few days ago reached 24-25c. Very warm for September. 

 

The cloud cover really doesn't help, 18-19c with cloud really feels quite chilly. If the sun was out it would feel more like 22-23c. 

Edited September 29, 2013 by matty007

[Mark Neal.]

Today was pleasant warm enough in sun, fresher breeze keeping things less humid and rather nice. Soon be the frosty cold mornings nothing like those crisp and fresh feeling mornings

[Tony27]

Given that the average temperature for September is 14c it is pretty decent, obviously not extraordinary or particularly special though. Could be a lot worse. 

 

You've also got to look at where you're situated, some places are reaching 22c, many a few days ago reached 24-25c. Very warm for September. 

 

The cloud cover really doesn't help, 18-19c with cloud really feels quite chilly. If the sun was out it would feel more like 22-23c. 

the average temp in september for our part of the country is 19c not 14c, but as it is late september now i'd say the average is probably 17c, temps are not bang on average every single day. some days we get temps a bit above average others a bit below, if it was 15c today nobody would say its cold for the time of year despite it being 2c below average for late sep, so 19c is not unusual at all 

 

september is not that much cooler than june but as it gets dark earlier in september people have a tendency to think that's it summer's over and think it should be cold, seasonal changes are a slow process, im still collecting crops and and their are still many flowers in full bloom, autumn proper usually kicks in around mid to late october here

Edited September 29, 2013 by Tony27

[Captain Shortwave]

A change to either NW’lys, W’lys or SW’lys can’t come soon enough. The current weather is awful. Grey cloudy dross for the 5th day out of 6. Thursday was an ideal autumn day: sunny with a min of 3.4C and max of 13.7C. Otherwise it’s been night after night of dire double-digit mins followed by daytime temperatures no higher than average and cloudy skies

The north sea is one awful body of water to live next to. I can't imagine how bad it can get up in the north east and well Shetland or Orkney it's even worse. At least here any wind south of east means the sea track is pretty short and hence low cloud is less of an issue.

[matty007]

the average temp in september for our part of the country is 19c not 14c, but as it is late september now i'd say the average is probably 17c, temps are not bang on average every single day. some days we get temps a bit above average others a bit below, if it was 15c today nobody would say its cold for the time of year despite it being 2c below average for late sep, so 19c is not unusual at all 

 

september is not that much cooler than june but as it gets dark earlier in september people have a tendency to think that's it summer's over and think it should be cold, seasonal changes are a slow process, im still collecting crops and and their are still many flowers in full bloom, autumn proper usually kicks in around mid to late october here

 

 

Absolutely, not disagreeing there. I've always said that Summer doesn't end just because we're in September. Sometimes Autumn comes earlier than expected and other times it comes later, there's no real pattern. To me this is very late Summer, the temp's are still pretty decent and as you say there's crops and flowers. 

 

I don't agree with you on the temps though, 19c is not the average temperature for September. It's higher than average most certainly but not by a great deal. Even if you took the full average for temps in July it would only equate to around 19c. Obviously this Summer it was much higher than average but then again Summer's like this year's aren't too common. 

[Tony27]

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&ved=0CEgQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.myweather2.com%2FCity-Town%2FUnited-Kingdom%2FCambridgeshire%2FCambridge%2Fclimate-profile.aspx&ei=uKhJUqyvHcqH0AXIrIHADw&usg=AFQjCNHzbb0C0hLxUDLM4vNtXy5YcghEsA

[chrcoluk]

ok managed to get some figures.

 

last 7 days of sept for my area in 2012. C

 

day/night

 

13/9 13/8 15/10 15/8 16/7 15/6 16/6

 

2013

 

19/11 20/10 19/12 19/8 19/8 19/11 20/12

 

looks hotter to me.  I think the real factor is the hot nights, when the night is cold the next day tends to be much more pleasant.

 

The MET blog says in 2012 sept seen temperatures below 0.  So I dont know what you guys are on about saying this year is normal.

 

Also in regards to sunlight, during the main part of august where you guys were complaining of rain, it was sunny almost every day here.

Edited September 30, 2013 by chrcoluk

[matty007]

ok managed to get some figures.

 

last 7 days of sept for my area in 2012. C

 

day/night

 

13/9 13/8 15/10 15/8 16/7 15/6 16/6

 

2013

 

19/11 20/10 19/12 19/8 19/8 19/11 20/12

 

looks hotter to me.  I think the real factor is the hot nights, when the night is cold the next day tends to be much more pleasant.

 

The MET blog says in 2012 sept seen temperatures below 0.  So I dont know what you guys are on about saying this year is normal.

 

Also in regards to sunlight, during the main part of august where you guys were complaining of rain, it was sunny almost every day here.

 

 

Yep, I said it's above average. Hardly a heatwave but above nonetheless. 

 

19c is NOT the average September temperature, any meteorological authority will tell you that.  

[Evening thunder]

Yep, I said it's above average. Hardly a heatwave but above nonetheless. 

 

19c is NOT the average September temperature, any meteorological authority will tell you that.  

 

The Met Office would beg to differ.. http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/public/weather/climate/cambridge#?tab=climateTables&region=uk

some parts of the SE/London have average daytime highs more like 20C.

 

19c isn't the normal average of the max+min temps (i.e what the CET uses), but recently they haven't been 19c, and people were saying the day temps were 19c.Reading some previous posts in this thread it seems the problem is the house temps for some reason, rather than it being 'hot' outside.

[Tony27]

Yep, I said it's above average. Hardly a heatwave but above nonetheless. 

 

19c is NOT the average September temperature, any meteorological authority will tell you that.  

may is a cooler month than september but if we got 19c in may you would probably say that's normal cos we are in spring, the difference is at that time of the year people expect warm weather cos we are heading into the warm season and the days are longer, now people expect it to be chilly with rain and gales most of the time cos summer is over, its getting dark earlier and the calendar has changed to october, well the seasons don't change in a flick of a switch 

Edited October 1, 2013 by Tony27

[smithyweather]

I would agree with that except I would say that the sun has a weaker strength in September than May and so 20c does not feel the same.

[matty007]

may is a cooler month than september but if we got 19c in may you would probably say that's normal cos we are in spring, the difference is at that time of the year people expect warm weather cos we are heading into the warm season and the days are longer, now people expect it to be chilly with rain and gales most of the time cos summer is over, its getting dark earlier and the calendar has changed to october, well the seasons don't change in a flick of a switch 

 

How many times do I have to say it. I've always said it's ridiculous that people think seasons change just because we're in a new month. I've always hated that and argued against it. That's not what I'm saying here. Septemeber and October can be warmer than August if you get the right conditions.

 

What I am saying is 19c isn't average. If you looked back at all the Septembers over the last 200 years there's no way 19c would come out as the average. More like 16-17c.  

The Met Office would beg to differ.. http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/public/weather/climate/cambridge#?tab=climateTables&region=uk

some parts of the SE/London have average daytime highs more like 20C.

 

19c isn't the normal average of the max+min temps (i.e what the CET uses), but recently they haven't been 19c, and people were saying the day temps were 19c.Reading some previous posts in this thread it seems the problem is the house temps for some reason, rather than it being 'hot' outside.

 

You're looking at the South. Take it over the entire country and it would come out at roughly 16c. 

[Evening thunder]

You're looking at the South. Take it over the entire country and it would come out at roughly 16c. 

 

Yes but I chose Cambridge because that's your location, and the poster you originally quoted about this 19c figure is in Bedfordshire..

(to which you started this debate by telling them they should expect 14c instead)

[chrcoluk]

Yep, I said it's above average. Hardly a heatwave but above nonetheless. 

 

19c is NOT the average September temperature, any meteorological authority will tell you that.  

 

on top of this we have had unusual amounts of high pressure, there is no wind almost all summer.  This has a huge impact on perceived temperatures.

[chrcoluk]

I would agree with that except I would say that the sun has a weaker strength in September than May and so 20c does not feel the same.

 

sept this year is defenitly warmer than may was.

 

I have just had to take my t-shirt off again due to sweat.

 

seems air temperature isnt the only factor, in may we had much more wind.

[feb1991blizzard]

December / Jan / feb or Nov if we are lucky as the air will be denser by then hence much more pleasant!

[damianslaw]

There is a lag effect with our weather in September and October i.e. it takes quite a while for conditions to average out as consistently what you might call cool, just like it takes a long time April and May to achieve consistently warmer pleasant feelings despite the sun's strength.

 

At this time of year whilst the sun's strength is weakening rapidly, indeed right now it has the same amount of strength as it does in mid March - think back to last March when we were achieving sub-zero days still even with the sun out.. the air over us takes a long time to undergo modification, helped by the fact SST's are just past there yearly maxima. The continent also takes a long time to cool down at this time of year - any airflow from between SW-E will still be notably warm even under cloudy skies such as we have seen today.

 

You need arctic/polar airstreams at this time of year to deliver any notable chill.

 

Conversely you need southerly airstreams of high pressure directly overhead in April and May to ensure any proper warmth. Southwesterlies in spring are much cooler than now. Easterlies can be miserably cold and northerlies are much more potent with associated snow and frost.

 

September on average is warmer than May.

October on average is warmer than April and on many occasion is warmer than May.

Even November on many occasion is warmer than April.

 

If you asked people on average which is the warmer season Spring or Autumn, most would probably say Spring - but they are wrong.

[Tony27]

yep its all physiological, you see it getting darker in september and you assume that's it summer's over time for it to get chilly and wet now, in march you see it getting lighter and you assume that's it winter's over time for it to get warm and sunny now, then there is shock amongst weather fans and joe public if we see warm weather in october, or snow in april cos that is not supposed to happen apparently

[chrcoluk]

I do agree that autumn is usually warmer than spring, and that psychological factor seems to be whats drawing people to turn on their heating as its defenitly not cold.

 

Those temps I posted in my previous post I now have a 3rd number the (feel temp)  I assume this means what it feels like taking wind etc. into account.

 

so day/night/feel(day) last 7 days sept.

 

2012

 

13/9/10 13/8/9 15/10/11 15/8/10 16/7/13 15/6/12 16/6/14

 

2013

 

19/11/20 20/10/20 19/12/18 19/8/18 19/8/19 19/11/18 20/12/19

 

The feel temperatures have sigificant gaps. in some days 10C.  Plus my room temp is hugely affected by wind as I have poor insulation, this explains a lot why I am feeling so hot this year with the complete lack of wind or even a breeze.

Edited October 4, 2013 by chrcoluk

[Bottesford]

Take any temperature (say 15c) - it will feel a lot cooler in autumn than it does in spring simply down to what you're used to. Going from regular 20c maxes to 15c maxes makes 15c feel cold. But going from 10c maxes to 15c maxes feels warm. It's called acclimatisation!

 

Also remember the sun is weaker and comes from a lower angle so a 15c sunny day in May feels loads warmer than a 15c in October. Of course that's an obvious observation for when being out & about in the sun but also don't forget it has an affect on buildings too - i.e. our living spaces and thus heating needs.

On the 15c sunny May day the building would be flooded in strong sunlight for a large part of the day so when you come inside it has warmed up significantly despite the relatively cool outdoor temperature. In October you might only catch a few hours of weaker sunlight doing much less of a job in raising the internal temperature of the building. Take today here in this house - it's 16c out and only 18.5c in. In May we could have 10c out and over 20c in!