Universe Theory And the theory of life!

[parmenides3]

No. the self-help section was a hundred years ago. The kind of philosophy I do is hard, rational and mind-bending. The kind of 'philosophy' found in self-help books is often no more than the oversold opinions of overinflated egoes who are on to a good way to make a fast buck.

I agree that psychology has more to do with facts and observation (some of it, anyway), whereas philosophy has to to with the very ideas and words themselves; this is certainly not to many people's tastes. However, at its best, philosophy deals with real issues in real life, for example, in Ethics.

With no great 'goal' for humanity to be collectively moving towards any meaning must be a 'localised' thing. If not the 'selfish gene' then what? a human construct to give meaning? Religion? family? nursing humanity itself? offsetting humanities impacts?

To me it breaks down into a few possibilties, 'hedonistic pursuits' , (the exporation of the 'sensual experience of living') are limited by age so only a 'temporary reason' (unless we move towards compulsary deletion at 40.....a bit too 'Logans' for me)

Procreation and investment into the offspring (again limited to when they mature and become fully independant)

The service of others (partners, freinds,community)

When you say ' a human construct to give meaning' you are closest to what I understand, though this isn't entirely it. But you have illustrated the problem I am struggling with at the moment: it is one thing to know what the meaning of being is - or, more accurately, how it comes to be - it is another thing to know how to fit a purpose into a life without falling into the trap of the 'will to power'. Even in 'service to others' there are pitfalls and traps.

If you know that, for Levinas, the only 'right' way to be is to be 'for the other' (which is about an attitude to others which exists in advance of meeting or communicating with them), then you'll understand why I think some of your suggestions are good ones; I just can't yet make the jump from 'good being' to 'good doing', though this is a technical matter, probably best not dealt with here.

:)P

Edit: No, Claudia, you are not simple: many of us yearn for simplification - we share a sense that just 'being' should be enough, and that this is only possible in a simpler world. Regretfully, this ideal of a simpler world is just an illusion. In a simpler world, you would be spending your time struggling to complete the tasks required simply to survive; eating, shelter, clothing, health; little time is left for pleasure, beauty, thought. Many people in the world live a 'simple' life, but given the choice, almost all of them would opt for our lives.

:)P

Edited March 15, 2007 by parmenides3

[Gallow_glass]

woah its like im a stranger here! erm soz guys not posted in a while!

alrighty lets see....

oh alright then

okay il post in later iv got hw to do!!!!

[Gray-Wolf]

woah its like im a stranger here! erm soz guys not posted in a while!

alrighty lets see....

oh alright then

okay il post in later iv got hw to do!!!!

What was that quote from 'The Simpsons'? oh yeah!

"the more you know, the further you go"......

catch you when you're done!!

[Claudia]

If you know that, for Levinas, the only 'right' way to be is to be 'for the other' (which is about an attitude to others which exists in advance of meeting or communicating with them), then you'll understand why I think some of your suggestions are good ones; I just can't yet make the jump from 'good being' to 'good doing', though this is a technical matter, probably best not dealt with here.

:)P

Edit: No, Claudia, you are not simple: many of us yearn for simplification - we share a sense that just 'being' should be enough, and that this is only possible in a simpler world. Regretfully, this ideal of a simpler world is just an illusion. In a simpler world, you would be spending your time struggling to complete the tasks required simply to survive; eating, shelter, clothing, health; little time is left for pleasure, beauty, thought. Many people in the world live a 'simple' life, but given the choice, almost all of them would opt for our lives.

:)P

Um, my comment about the self help section was about the psychology books you have read not a dig at philosophy.

Levinas sounds good, I think people think about themselves to much and compare themselves to what others have, its not healthy and I dont think it makes people happy. My all time fav study is a 'good doing' its by Daniel Goleman in Emotional Intelligence, he tells the story of how he had the insparation to come up with the experiments in the first place which is good in itself just a bit long. He started his own experiments by walking down a street and smiling, maybe a cheery comment while they were passing then he would watch and note down the resonse. This had a knock on effect and the subject carried the good will and passed it on This type of experiment has so much mileage, brings pleasure to the recipient and I had such good fun with it. EG You know how you go into a shop and get a right cow of an assistant, taking on the challenge of trying to get their mood to change and watching the knock on effect compleatly changes the shopping experience where you would be Tuted off with the rude assistant and therfore streesed. Go on you will have to try it, let me know if you do. I do understand your technical matter though, sometimes life is just like that, but its well worth keep trying ! So what have you learnt that has had the biggest influence to your life ?

"a simpler world is just an illusion" :lol: NNNNnnnnnooooooo!!!!!! OK eating, yup I like eating :lol: I also like hunter gathering its very satisfiing,shelter well that depends caves were mostly used because the human eating critters were a tad bigger in those days and so its just the fire possibly some bedding ?clothing, who needs them with all those fit men around oh and we were alot hairier in those days, well you kill the meet to eat so you have the skin already you just dry it in the sun. Health, well if you were in poor health you would be unable to escape preditors and get eaten, thats how the good genes used to get carried in the good old days.Beauty, now im not saying I dont own a brush but..........Thought, hmmmmm yes I know tricky ! The modern brain extends back at least 120,000 years, were we became consciously aware and externalised cognition and projected instantaitions of needs in the form of sophisticated tools, complex language and art. I enjoy art and it was produced before this time just not with the same capabilities. I seem to go through life and gather questions these annoy me untill I find the answer to them, its both annoying and pleasant (sometimes I wonder if its a disease) so it comes down to a choice of keeping the external cognition hmmm they do say ignorance is bliss sooo......The last one left is pleasure well I have already covered all the things that make me tick so... And you are forgetting about the plus points less people, freedom to roam, less periods, organic and free range food for nought..... So come on then whats the perfect time to live ?

GW well its not Dawkins

[Gallow_glass]

I been thinking (which is rare! :lol: ) and ive been thinking

that for as long as we can tell theres been 'time' but time altogether was a mans/womans (not sure)

way of dealing with day to day things as today we take for granted as some thing that gets us through the day!

[parmenides3]

When was/is the 'perfect' time to live? That would very much depend on where you lived, who your parents were (rich or poor, free or slave), whether you were male or female, strong or weak, etc... Each period of history, in different parts of the world, has it's own special appeal. Perhaps Britain in the early part of the twentieth century, if you were financially independent, would have been as good a time as any.

I wasn't trying to suggest before that simplification is not possible, it is something I yearn for, too, at times, but it comes with a price. In the modern world, the freedom to choose to live simply depends on so many other things existing which are not simple, like transport networks, medicine, law, etc. Living simply doesn not need sacrifices, as doing without things isn't a sacrifice if you don't feel the need to have them in the first place, but the ability to choose to do so is as much a function of the general stability and wealth of our society as anything; we are fortunate in having the luxury of being able to choose.

By the way, it takes quite a long time and quite a large number of hours to turn an animal skin into an item of clothing which doesn't stink, infest you with lice and fleas, or leak when it rains. And gues who got to do all those time consuming tasks? The men? Hah!

We do forage, Mrs P & I; collecting brambles, wild mushrooms, elderflowers and berries, fruit, etc., as well as grow a little of our own in the miniscule plot behind our house. We are also both lucky in that neither of us appears to have the 'shopping bug' (with the odd exceptional days). Do we mlive simply? In some ways, but only insofar as our need (that's the world we live in) to sustain ourselves financially by working allows.

Sorry, this is just a bit of a ramble, really.

GG: time. interesting subject. What is time? Is it just a way of measuring the days, the seasons? Or is there something more basic than that; is it the continual flow of consecutive 'nows' that emerge, pass and become our past, our story, in line, or against our hopes, fears, expectations, dreams?

:)P

[Gray-Wolf]

Lest we forget.

We are bound by our own personal experience of life and so our 'worst' and 'best' experiences are our yardstick by which we measure our life.

Past peoples had exactly the same yardstick and ,as such, were accustomed to what we would view as privations. In our world here in the UK today we live 'better' than William the Ba$tard in his drafty old castles and poor health-care so ,in this respect, we live better than Kings but we, as they, measure ourselves against those we perceive as 'better off' than us and so many of our 'kingly living peers' still feel poorly done by.

Whilst we may hanker after some past idyll I feel that unless we grew and developed in that world then we would pretty soon be floored by the limitations of that age.

[Gallow_glass]

The best era must have been in the Roman era

[Gray-Wolf]

I'm not too keen in living in any of the so called 'civilisations' that were underpinned by slave labour as I'd probably end up as one!!!

My own fascination is with the people who inhabited the European 'great plains' that were exposed for most of the last ice age (now the western continental shelf of Europe), somewhere to the south of the great river (the Rhine Seine Thames et al flowed down the North sea, through the channel and out into the atlantic).

Though a harsh existance I think I would love the opportunity to be a person able to survive, and live well, off the bounty of the southern plains and the herds they must have followed/hunted.

I imagine them as a kind of european 'plains Indian' and ,for a number of thousands of years, their life must have been quite stable.

[Gallow_glass]

yes and we could some kingd of nomadic horde! like the huns or the samartians!

in that we would live ofn trees and horses ah the good life