The North Atlantic Current Is Gone

[noel]

well here is someone that seems to dismiss it as a load of rubbish with a few facts too

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100802141559AArCPZ1

and sea temp around Ireland still warm for time of year

http://www.met.ie/latest/buoy.asp

Edited September 7, 2010 by noel

[Nights King]

If the gulf stream was to be "disrupted" or altered even temporarily how long would it take for the uk to start feeling its cooling efects?

[SNOW-MAN2006]

Has anyone noticed the cold SST around much of the UK? Many places in single figures according to Netweather extra. According to the actual observed temperatures as opposed to the model projections they are some 7c lower than the model is predicting. Anyone seeing the same thing?

Have you seen this link? http://www.netweather.tv/index.cgi?action=charts;type=seatemps;sess=

It tells quite a different story... temperatures around average but a significantly warmer than average north atlantic, especially around greenland and N.america coast.

SM06

[eyeofthestorm]

From NetWeather Extra.

Torquay 10.5°C

Bournemouth 10.5°C

Newquay 10.2°C

Brighton 16.9°C

Great Yarmouth 17.2°C

Skegness 15.7°C

Scarborough 8.8°C

St Andrews 9.8°C

Skye 10.3°C

Blackpool 9.6°C

Minehead 10.2°C

St Marys 10.1°C

Jersey 11.3°C

Falmouth 10.4°C

Most Places Well Below Normal.

Edited September 7, 2010 by eyeofthestorm

[Optimus Prime]

If the gulf stream was to be "disrupted" or altered even temporarily how long would it take for the uk to start feeling its cooling efects?

You only need to look at last winter to see what would happen. It would go from extremely mild to cold.

[Essan]

From NetWeather Extra.

Torquay 10.5°C

Bournemouth 10.5°C

Newquay 10.2°C

Brighton 16.9°C

Great Yarmouth 17.2°C

Skegness 15.7°C

Scarborough 8.8°C

St Andrews 9.8°C

Skye 10.3°C

Blackpool 9.6°C

Minehead 10.2°C

St Marys 10.1°C

Jersey 11.3°C

Falmouth 10.4°C

Most Places Well Below Normal.

What temps are those?

Current sea temps around Britain are between 13c in the Orkneys to 17c in the South and SW.

http://www.getaforecast.com/weather-charts-seatemp.php

Air temps across Britain are similarly between 13c and 20c. All very prefectly normal

[Terminal Moraine]

From NetWeather Extra.

Torquay 10.5°C

Bournemouth 10.5°C

Newquay 10.2°C

Brighton 16.9°C

Great Yarmouth 17.2°C

Skegness 15.7°C

Scarborough 8.8°C

St Andrews 9.8°C

Skye 10.3°C

Blackpool 9.6°C

Minehead 10.2°C

St Marys 10.1°C

Jersey 11.3°C

Falmouth 10.4°C

Most Places Well Below Normal.

There's definitely something amiss with those figures. It seems inconceivable that there would be a 6.4c difference between the sea temperature at Brighton and that at Bournemouth. As for 9.6c at Blackpool ???

[Thundery wintry showers]

I think some of the milder winters would struggle to get a SST significantly below 9.6 at Blackpool!

[Polar Continental]

The up to date Sea surface temperature anomaly chart shows the north Atlantic is well above normal, up to 5 or 6c off the coast of southern Greenland, some cold anomalies further south. Nothing much unusual off the coast of the UK.

La Nina can clearly be seen in full force across the tropical Pacific.

http://weather.unisys.com/surface/sst_anom.gif

[Guest]

From NetWeather Extra.

Torquay 10.5°C

Bournemouth 10.5°C

Newquay 10.2°C

Brighton 16.9°C

Great Yarmouth 17.2°C

Skegness 15.7°C

Scarborough 8.8°C

St Andrews 9.8°C

Skye 10.3°C

Blackpool 9.6°C

Minehead 10.2°C

St Marys 10.1°C

Jersey 11.3°C

Falmouth 10.4°C

Most Places Well Below Normal.

This does seem odd and I wonder whether the positioning of the thermometer could make for such differences as this.

The situations I am envisaging are where the temperature is measured in close proximity to the outflow from a river, the temperature of which could be cooler than the ambient temperature of the sea.

I have notice the same kind of thing in Southern France, especially in the spring when the temperatures of a river would not be very much above freezing as a result of melting snows from the mountains.

Perhaps certain criteria should be laid down when measuring sea temps to ensure more uniformity of the circumstances in which they are taken.

I think some of the milder winters would struggle to get a SST significantly below 9.6 at Blackpool!

.

There is always an easy solution to every human problem - neat, plausible, and wrong." - H L Mencken

UK Winter Snow Events Index Total (all snow events in a September-June season are added together and given an index from 1 to 5 for distribution & severity)

Long-term average (1947-2009): 34

1978/79: 64

1981/82: 49

1992/93: 13

2008/09: 35

2009/10: 59 (confirmed, barring some very exceptional late snowfalls). Highest since 1978/79, 3rd highest since 1947.

Cleadon weather records back to 1993:

http://tws27.50webs....ther/index.html

NOTE- 2006/2007 not yet uploaded.

My personal manifesto can be found here:

http://tws27.50webs.com/index.html

My upcoming modification for Doom 3:

http://tws27.50webs....nemy/index.html

Come on give us a treat and include the indices for 1947 and 1963

[weathe20]

I must I am enjoying this thread. Does anyone have any links to to main players in this discussion. I mean any well respected links to any sceintists research conducted in the last couple of months? Thanks.

[Thundery wintry showers]

Come on give us a treat and include the indices for 1947 and 1963

1962/63: 53, 1946/47: 78.

I had put the indices up in a thread earlier, and also have them on my website here:

http://tws27.50webs.com/Weather/snow.html

As for those SSTs, I still think something is seriously amiss.

[BristolBlizzard]

I must I am enjoying this thread. Does anyone have any links to to main players in this discussion. I mean any well respected links to any sceintists research conducted in the last couple of months? Thanks.

heres a link i looked at :0) http://geraldcelentechannel.blogspot.com/2010/09/gulf-stream-has-stopped-britain-heading.html

[weathe20]

After a little internet research this story first appeard back in 2008, this is nothing new. The added oil spill wont make any differrence in my opinion.

Edited September 8, 2010 by weathe20

[eyeofthestorm]

Unless I am reading it wrong the link below seems to establish the North Atlantic current has indeed stopped. There is virtually nothing impacting the UK and Norway.

http://polar.ncep.noaa.gov/ofs/viewer.shtml?-natl-cur-0-large-rundate=latest

Now compare this to august 20th last year and you will see the huge contrast.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j270/JohnnyGunn/NOAAAtlCurr20090820.png Found this via solarcycle24

Adding to that, the SST temperatures I posted yesterday from NetWeather extra after doing some searching on the net, some are I think maintained by private industry and some by the met office. Now either the Private sector has it wrong, Or the Met Office is manipulating data... Surely Not!!! :lol:

Is this down to the BP Oil spill? Probably not, the Gulf Stream has been weakening for years, and now appears to of taken a major step further

[snowlover2009]

Unless I am reading it wrong the link below seems to establish the North Atlantic current has indeed stopped. There is virtually nothing impacting the UK and Norway.

http://polar.ncep.no...-rundate=latest

Now compare this to august 20th last year and you will see the huge contrast.

http://i82.photobuck...urr20090820.png Found this via solarcycle24

Adding to that, the SST temperatures I posted yesterday from NetWeather extra after doing some searching on the net, some are I think maintained by private industry and some by the met office. Now either the Private sector has it wrong, Or the Met Office is manipulating data... Surely Not!!! :lol:

Is this down to the BP Oil spill? Probably not, the Gulf Stream has been weakening for years, and now appears to of taken a major step further

that is absolutely astonishing

After a little internet research this story first appeard back in 2008, this is nothing new. The added oil spill wont make any differrence in my opinion.

there was no real data showing the gulf stream weakening a couple of year ago though and there was only just theories more so. whereas the last year and this year there seems to be a massive weakening if not stalling of it on the gulf stream data. it looks like it to me or unless i am reading the charts wrong. if you look at the post above, you will know what i mean.

BTW just PMed glacier point, a very experienced member of the site and asked him about this. because if i am looking at it correct, there seems to be nothing hardly left of the gulf stream. there is the odd big patch, but i doubt the whole stream would have to fade to bring us very cold winters.

Edited September 8, 2010 by snowlover2009

[Cymro]

Unless I am reading it wrong the link below seems to establish the North Atlantic current has indeed stopped. There is virtually nothing impacting the UK and Norway.

http://polar.ncep.noaa.gov/ofs/viewer.shtml?-natl-cur-0-large-rundate=latest

Now compare this to august 20th last year and you will see the huge contrast.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j270/JohnnyGunn/NOAAAtlCurr20090820.png Found this via solarcycle24

Adding to that, the SST temperatures I posted yesterday from NetWeather extra after doing some searching on the net, some are I think maintained by private industry and some by the met office. Now either the Private sector has it wrong, Or the Met Office is manipulating data... Surely Not!!! :lol:

Is this down to the BP Oil spill? Probably not, the Gulf Stream has been weakening for years, and now appears to of taken a major step further

Now that makes for interesting and believable reading, thank you for posting those links, It's unprecedented how quiet the Atlantic looks at the moment. Is there any data however to show the exact image say a month ago? as in is this just a short term thing or a definite long term trend (within this sites statistics)

[snowlover2009]

Now that makes for interesting and believable reading, thank you for posting those links, It's unprecedented how quiet the Atlantic looks at the moment. Is there any data however to show the exact image say a month ago? as in is this just a short term thing or a definite long term trend (within this sites statistics)

yes but in scientific terms if the gulf stream was to really weaken or stall, is greenland supposed to warm up because ssts are quite warm there, which is still good for us either way. Like with no gulf stream, you can easily say we would go into a massive change of climate, but would it mean greenland gets warmer weather or colder weather??? because that would explain the ssts up there.

Edited September 8, 2010 by snowlover2009

[Essan]

Surface velocities are affected by weather. The main current is well below the surface. Compare the 200m velocities The Gulf Stream is very much alive and well.

(the surface flow may well have been disrupted by Hurricane Earl)

SSTs around Britain are perfectly normal - anyone living by the coast can check for themselves Or maybe all Britain's swimmers and sailors fishermen and surfers are in on the conspiracy? :lol:

btw if the Gulf Stream has stopped, it seems to be good news for Iceland which is currently experiencing a remarkable September heatwave and experiencing the highest temps it's had all year!

[frostyjoe]

yes but in scientific terms if the gulf stream was to really weaken or stall, is greenland supposed to warm up because ssts are quite warm there, which is still good for us either way. Like with no gulf stream, you can easily say we would go into a massive change of climate, but would it mean greenland gets warmer weather or colder weather??? because that would explain the ssts up there.

We'd still have a crap winter because we are near the atlantic and we are an island.

[snowlover2009]

Surface velocities are affected by weather. The main current is well below the surface. Compare the 200m velocities The Gulf Stream is very much alive and well.

(the surface flow may well have been disrupted by Hurricane Earl)

SSTs around Britain are perfectly normal - anyone living by the coast can check for themselves Or maybe all Britain's swimmers and sailors fishermen and surfers are in on the conspiracy? :lol:

btw if the Gulf Stream has stopped, it seems to be good news for Iceland which is currently experiencing a remarkable September heatwave and experiencing the highest temps it's had all year!

that would be the point. iceland and greenland would warm up quite a lot if the gulf stream did stop or weaken. just like in the last winter. the gulf stream was further south while greenland and iceland had a very mild winter

[Met4Cast]

that would be the point. iceland and greenland would warm up quite a lot if the gulf stream did stop or weaken. just like in the last winter. the gulf stream was further south while greenland and iceland had a very mild winter

Wasn't it the Jet Stream that was further South? Even so, those images are remarkable.

[snowlover2009]

Wasn't it the Jet Stream that was further South? Even so, those images are remarkable.

the jet i think is affected by the gulf stream. the jet was to the south, but i think it was the gulf stream moving up to greenland not sure. confusing to say the least.

here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shutdown_of_thermohaline_circulation

Edited September 8, 2010 by snowlover2009

[Met4Cast]

the jet i think is affected by the gulf stream. the jet was to the south, but i think it was the gulf stream moving up to greenland not sure. confusing to say the least.

here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shutdown_of_thermohaline_circulation

It's definitely interesting. With all the articles recently about the Gulf Stream stopping, the sequence you posted above does make me quite excited. Maybe someone more experienced can voice their opinion about it, because I don't really know too much about the gulf.

[snowlover2009]

It's definitely interesting. With all the articles recently about the Gulf Stream stopping, the sequence you posted above does make me quite excited. Maybe someone more experienced can voice their opinion about it, because I don't really know too much about the gulf.

i PMed glacier point on it. he is experienced.