Nw Severe Flooding Thread - 19Th Nov Onwards.

[Tom Quintavalle]

Thanks for the link weather09,

A nice idea from the Met Office there and as stated, well presented. Must give them credit for pretty accurate warnings and forecast for the areas which have been seriously affected.

Our own John H was pretty much spot on with his warnings and forecast too, well done John.

Regards,

Tom.

[dogs32]

Couldnt agree more...

J.H he was saying how bad it was going to be and he was spot on!!

The same for the Met Office spot on with warning's

good forecasting...

On a positive note I think its a miracle more wasnt killed...

with respect to the Brave Policeman who saved a bus load of people crossing the bridge MOMENTS before it collasped

Edited November 20, 2009 by dogs32

[Cookie]

very sad news re the police officer

[Terminal Moraine]

Interesting presentation.

Still wondering, would the county have been burried if all the rain fell as snow?

It's something of a hypothetical question, Stelmer as, if the air had been cold enough for snow , it wouldn't have been capable of holding anywhere near as much moisture and the amount of precipitation would have been much less.

Having said that, to answer the hypothetical question, Seathwaite's rainfall total would have translated into about 3.5 to 4 mts of level, dry snow.

[jello]

Hope the situations a bit better in Cumbria.

update for Ireland

0 Flood Warnings

County Antrim - 16 Flood Watches

County Armagh - 10 Flood Watches

County Down - 8 Flood Watches

County Fermanagh - 18 Flood Watches

County Londonderry - 6 Flood Watches

County Tyrone - 5 Flood Watches

[Osbourne One-Nil]

Yes, a nice presentation, lotsof rainfall totals and the radar sequence is an excellent idea.

And I slot in somewhere in the middle with 312mm for the month. Interesting to see that Shap has received more than 130mm more than I have, yet it's only 7 miles away as the crow flies.

[BornFromTheVoid]

A few pics here from Cork city.

The first time in living memory that many areas of the city have been flooded, usually occurs during spring tides as apposed to simply rainfall...

A little article on the Met Eireann website about the rain http://met.ie/news/display.asp?ID=38

[Cookie]

amazing photos really eye opening,

been really impressed with the sky news coverage the BBC's has been rubbish.

[Tom Quintavalle]

Yes, very sad news regarding the police officer. It certainly highlights and gets you thinking how much all the emergency services put their lives on the line in these dangerous situations, when protecting the general public.

No doubt there will be a lot of analysis done in the coming days on the causes of such copious amounts of rainfall.

Some of the reasons are apparent when you look at the SST anomaly chart for the Atlantic, at the moment.

An airstream all the way up from the Azores region moving over anomalously high sea temperatures for the great majority of its track, S.W. of the U.K.

Also contrast that with the cold pool west of the Azores region , which stretches towards Newfoundland, which has added fuel to this conveyor belt of moisture which became very slow moving over the affected area, then add in the orographic lift and you get the resultant dynamic rainfall figures.

http://weather.unisys.com/surface/sst_anom.gif

Regards,

Tom.

Edited November 20, 2009 by TomSE20

[MAF]

well after a long and eventful night last night, i hope the area has a rest from it before the wind and rain pick up again tomorrow

strange how once an area gets hit once it seems to get hit again so soon after. like the weather has an agenda

there has been praise for the way the met office has handled the forecasting of this event, but for once i reckon there would be no complaints if they get tomorrow totally wrong

[shuggee]

"The most rainfall ever recorded in the United Kingdom"- BBC News.

[johnholmes]

And I slot in somewhere in the middle with 312mm for the month. Interesting to see that Shap has received more than 130mm more than I have, yet it's only 7 miles away as the crow flies.

with a SW strong moist and unusually warm flow its a pretty good illustration of wind facing hill slopes getting far more rain than lower down-or have I got the geography very wrong?

Edited November 20, 2009 by johnholmes

[MAF]

"The most rainfall ever recorded in the United Kingdom"- BBC News.

hello shuggs, been here last night and watching things develope on the news channels it was not hard to believe the phrase "biblical amounts of rain" the sad thing is that it is still only November and the autumn/winter could well be a record in itself as the wettest ever for the Cumbria area. good luck to everyone there for tomorrow, hope the wind and rain are not as bad as forecast.

[Cookie]

so question really now it what lessons can be learned?

[Osbourne One-Nil]

with a SW strong moist and unusually warm flow its a pretty good illustration of wind facing hill slopes getting far more rain than lower down-or have I got the geography very wrong?

No sure. The nearest west-facing hills to me are about 6 miles away (the western flanks of the Pennines), whilst Shap is closer to fells, but they're to its east. Perhaps they "benefit" from orographic enhancement...or whatever it's called?

[Mondy]

so question really now it what lessons can be learned?

Don't build property near two main rivers - when swollen with record amounts of rainfall - we all see what happens.

[Cookie]

Don't build property near two main rivers - when swollen with record amounts of rainfall - we all see what happens.

agreed, but still going to happen, people are still going to take risks.

[Tom Quintavalle]

A Lake District map to illustrate John Hs and OONs point re. rainfall amounts on the western slopes of the Lake District hills compared to the eastern parts of the area. This has been an extreme example of an orographic rainfall event.

http://www.lake-district-guides.co.uk/images/lakesmap.jpg

Regards,

Tom.

[MAF]

so question really now it what lessons can be learned?

when all is said and done i dont think we will ever learn to control the weather. i suppose the only thing to be done now is improve flood defences. rebuild and hope that it doesnt get any worse then this

[Liam J]

what a disaster in parts of the county, its hard to beleive watching your local towns on the news, transport is severely effected roads under water the mian trunk road out of cumbria east A66 to the M6 motorway is shut becasuse bassenthwaite lake has over flowed and a bridge near keswick has collapsed and the rubble is directing the flow over the road.

i went out for a drive and it took me 1.5 hours to travel a distance which would normally take 20 mins!! theres sheds and structures floating down the rivers and i saw some large round bales of silage scattered about also, reports say 7 bridges have been washed away in the area it is a complete disaster.

and the forecast is not good tomorrow with 50mm more rain with no where to go or saturate into apart from the rivers...on top of that gales again, and sunday has the risk of severe gales and with the ground so wet the trees are at risk of being uprooted, not a good outlook into next week either.

i have a feeling the flooding may not be over although the volume of rain will not match the last 24hours, any rain now is to much there is just no where for it to go...

autumn/winter 09/10 may prove to be an exceptional one for rainfall and storms.

stay safe all

Edited November 20, 2009 by james12

[Mondy]

agreed, but still going to happen, people are still going to take risks.

Indeed. When I was in your neck of the woods this summer, couldn't believe the amount of new housing being built - you and I both know some of the areas in the western isles are damn close to the seas around there. I mean, it looked like some locations were just sitting ducks - and people blame rising sea levels etc...it's down to bloody bad planning and greed.

[Cookie]

Indeed. When I was in your neck of the woods this summer, couldn't believe the amount of new housing being built - you and I both know some of the areas in the western isles are damn close to the seas around there. I mean, it looked like some locations were just sitting ducks - and people blame rising sea levels etc...it's down to bloody bad planning and greed.

yeah we do have issues sometimes with flooding in the town center nothing major, but majority of it coming from the sea like you say. thankfully where im located if the sea did get this high we have a major catastrophe on our hands.

[MAF]

off topic, i know. but just to answer Cookie and Mondy. yes, building away from rivers would be an answer. but as with many many villages and towns in the UK, they were built a long long time ago and usually around rivers. so it is these towns and villages, through not fault of their own, who suffer from flooding. and deserve better flood defences then they possibly have now. but the crux of the matter is, how do you know your town/village will ever suffer the same affects as the ones in Cumbria this week. its impossible to predict and thus very difficult to plan a defence. so i think there would be as much an outcry for a local government spending millions on defences that may never be used as there would be for the people who have suffered yesterday who have asked before for better defences.

[pyrotech]

I do not like being alarmist but does anyone else see similarity between last wednesday and Thursdays weather charts and this coming Tuesdays. can anyone comment on this and if and why this weather front may deminish and give or not give excessive rain.

included wed and thurs fax charts here, now look at next tuesdays almost identical. JH whats your thoughts?

here is nxt tuesdays

Edited November 20, 2009 by pyrotech

[cyclonic happiness]

I wonder if flooding noawadays is more of a disaster than it used to be, if you think about it, in the past they had no electric or gas...now water on tap...most didn't commute to work, no carpets and folk probably didn't even shut up shop if it had 2 feet of water in it.

That's probably why places like Tewkesbury got built.

I mean would anybody even think about building a town on the flood plain at the confluence of two of the country's biggest rivers? (Severn and Avon), they'd be laughed out of the planning office.

I think that this is more of a "modern" issue, probably why we are so ill prepared for it, even with all the latest technology.