Scotland Regional Discussion - Cold Spell Part 2

[JoeShmoe]

Wonder if were at risk of freezing rain tonight?

That stuff is lethal, saw it once when i was in New York, instant ice everywhere. More disruption than snow

[November13]

Yes we have a snow shovel that still has the label on it in the garage. Bought in November!

Best place for stats although they don't tell the whole story is:#

http://www.wetterzentrale.de/topkarten/fsreaeur.html

On this site you can put any date in and it will give you the temp on that day.

Here is a graph of historic snow days in Scotland covering a period of 30 years. Ok it's quite high up but never the less the average is nearly 14 days of falling snow in January - 9 in December - 5 November and Feb/March about 11 each. Total average falling snow days is 50. I am guessing we have had about 15 max days with falling snow this winter even in that area. So unless the snow fallls for 35 days till the end of March we are miles away from the overall average.

[spindrift1980]

Nov 13 - i think we all need to go back and look at the stats and see what winters were actually like and compare to this year and see where this year rates. I am quite interested to see the results. Where would be best the place to view the stats?

There is a huge set of records (albeit mostly partial) of readings at weather stations in the UK going back decades here:

http://www.tutiempo....Kingdom/GB.html

Can't say I've ever trawled through them in detail let alone attempted any kind of analysis, however plenty of mild winter weather in decades prior to the late 80s/early 90s can be found without too much difficulty if you dip in to them.

EDIT: having looked properly, they have re-designed this website and now only seem to have annual averages etc - they used to have daily readings going back years for all the weather stations listed - perhaps they are elsewhere on the site but can't see them.

Edited February 8, 2012 by spindrift1980

[A Winter's Tale]

Here is a graph of historic snow days in Scotland covering a period of 30 years. Ok it's quite high up but never the less the average is nearly 14 days of falling snow in January - 9 in December - 5 November and Feb/March about 11 each. Total average falling snow days is 50. I am guessing we have had about 15 max days with falling snow this winter even in that area. So unless the snow fallls for 35 days till the end of March we are miles away from the overall average.

That's for one of the colder places - Eskdalemuir and it's above 200m. Not the best representation of Scotland's snow and totally disagree about April being snowier than November and March snowier than December.

[A Winter's Tale]

Nov 13 - i think we all need to go back and look at the stats and see what winters were actually like and compare to this year and see where this year rates. I am quite interested to see the results. Where would be best the place to view the stats?

Check my Blog - goes back to 1999 for Glasgow and I'm currently doing Edinburgh.

At the moment, Glasgow is having one of it's snowiest winter whereas Edinburgh is perhaps experiencing its poorest winter since the 90s.

[LomondSnowstorm]

Wonder if were at risk of freezing rain tonight?

That stuff is lethal, saw it once when i was in New York, instant ice everywhere. More disruption than snow

It's a risk, dewpoint here is wel below 0C with temperature at 1C.

Uppers are simply too high for snow:

[November13]

That's for one of the colder places - Eskdalemuir and it's above 200m. Not the best representation of Scotland's snow and totally disagree about April being snowier than November and March snowier than December.

Here is the other extreme Tiree Atlantic maritime climate sea level. This is the met office stats so it's not guesswork it's fact. Even at Tiree they have averaged more snow days than Central Scotland this year. Remember it's a condensed average so there will be less snowy years in here as well. Total of 21 or so days of falling snow average and we know what Tiree is like very mild.

[Big Innes Madori]

Check my Blog - goes back to 1999 for Glasgow and I'm currently doing Edinburgh.

At the moment, Glasgow is having one of it's snowiest winter whereas Edinburgh is perhaps experiencing its poorest winter since the 90s.

Campsie, ye could probably include Fife in the poorest winter since whenever

Been dire through here :huh:

Big Innes

[A Winter's Tale]

Campsie, ye could probably include Fife in the poorest winter since whenever

Been dire through here :huh:

Big Innes

Yeah - for the borders, fife, lothians, angus, perthshire it's been poor, for the west - statistically it's been decent in terms of falling snow days and lying snow was good (very good in December) but it's been disapointing that we didn't seen anything more substantial in January - however I have enjoyed the cold weather since mid January with lots of frosts.

We've still got a lot of February left and there are signs that not only Fife and the east could catch up with what's been lost with a number of snowfall days/good snow event - we could end up in a signficant, prolonged cold snap if things work out right with the Greenland High.

And in Spring we could catch up with what winter has lost - for example the past two winters have seen the biggest highland snow event in March in years before Spring usually came to the rescue, plus my largest snowfall happened in March 2006.

[A Winter's Tale]

Well totalling the 3 monthly averages you get 8C, so that's 1.7C needed to get a below average winter. Doable certainly, especially if northerlies are on the cards...

Hopefully we will get 1.7C or lower for this month. I wonder how cold the mean is now and whether there will be any more cold spells to keep it low or make it lower.

[LomondSnowstorm]

Hopefully we will get 1.7C or lower for this month. I wonder how cold the mean is now and whether there will be any more cold spells to keep it low or make it lower.

Currently I'd reckon it's at about 1C, getting milder tomorrow and Friday but getting colder again through the weekend. My guess of 1.4C made in late November hopefully won't be far off.

[blitzen]

There appears to be a bit more hope now for us northerners for next week, especially if the UKMO verifies. Between the Meto update today and that Accuweather forecast, it looked like we were definitely staring at a return to westerlies next week. The way winter has gone for us this year up here, I am not counting my chickens tho'. If I had to be picky, (which I suppose I am) I certainly would have preferred a north easterly set up from this as opposed to a northerly (sorry HC) That would be the final straw as northerlies usually don't deliver for here. Of course I could be completely off on one (again) so feel free all?

Edited February 8, 2012 by Blitzen

[Guest]

That's for one of the colder places - Eskdalemuir and it's above 200m. Not the best representation of Scotland's snow and totally disagree about April being snowier than November and March snowier than December.

Settle the argument here:

http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/climate/uk/averages/regmapavge.html#wscotland

By my reckoning you're half right and half wrong, at least for the west of Scotland

[Guest]

Check my Blog - goes back to 1999 for Glasgow and I'm currently doing Edinburgh.

At the moment, Glasgow is having one of it's snowiest winter whereas Edinburgh is perhaps experiencing its poorest winter since the 90s.

That all depends how you define "snowiest"...the total snow depth this winter has been a joke. Number of days with snow cover has been relatively high compared to the depth though.

[Mr Frost]

Yes, I live just down the road from Glasgow and I can assure you it has not been the snowiest.

6 days with snow falling, 1 day of which had prolonged snow showers for a good few hours.

Pretty much bog standard affair for Glasgow.

[doctormog]

Wonder if were at risk of freezing rain tonight?

That stuff is lethal, saw it once when i was in New York, instant ice everywhere. More disruption than snow

Yes, it looks like a real possibility and the wording of some of the warnings is in such a way to let people know just how treacherous things could become underfoot if it does happen.

[snowy owl]

Thanks CMD, SD1980 and Nov 13 for the links and the data. Could be a while compiling some figures, but if we get snowed in next week i'll have plenty of analysis to do!

Freezing rain, have we ever had that before? Trying to think if i can ever recall such an event here?

[A Winter's Tale]

Yes, I live just down the road from Glasgow and I can assure you it has not been the snowiest.

6 days with snow falling, 1 day of which had prolonged snow showers for a good few hours.

Pretty much bog standard affair for Glasgow.

Check my blog - this winter is already up there with the top 5 in terms with days of observed falling snow at the airport since 1999/2000. I think Lanarkshire had missed out on two or three of the events that fell as snow to W Stirlingshire and Dunbartonshire with showers mostly gliding over Cowal, S Loch Lomond, the Kilaptricks and Campsies.

Bog standard could be the case for some parts but for this particular area this winter is nowhere near as bad as some of those in the naughties - December was absolutely fantastic - only downside was January lacking on a decent snow event!

[BlizzardConditions]

Snowy, on phone so can't see locations but Glasgow had freezing rain in - I think - Dec 2008. Was awful, people slithering about and breaking bones! Much worse than snow as someone commented earlier.

[A Winter's Tale]

Apparently latest ECM run is poor.

Didn't have the oppurtunity to have a proper look at GFS and UKMO but I get the impression that anything we'll get out of a Greenland High would be 2 day toppler - pretty standard for any winter. It'll have to be a bloomin amazing northerly for Central Areas to benefit (particular western areas) considering the many, many endless miles of mountains in the Highlands.

I hope that isn't the case but there is a possibility that a Greenland High could be equally as useless as a Scandinavian High.

[LomondSnowstorm]

Thanks CMD, SD1980 and Nov 13 for the links and the data. Could be a while compiling some figures, but if we get snowed in next week i'll have plenty of analysis to do!

Freezing rain, have we ever had that before? Trying to think if i can ever recall such an event here?

January 2009 had a few of them I think *goes off to investigate*.

Apparently latest ECM run is poor.

Didn't have the oppurtunity to have a proper look at GFS and UKMO but I get the impression that anything we'll get out of a Greenland High would be 2 day toppler - pretty standard for any winter. It'll have to be a bloomin amazing northerly for Central Areas to benefit (particular western areas) considering the many, many endless miles of mountains in the Highlands.

I hope that isn't the case but there is a possibility that a Greenland High could be equally as useless as a Scandinavian High.

It's not a proper Greenland high if it topples, by definition. It's a mid Atlantic ridge, but the hope is it topples eastwards and brings in an easterly/northeasterly, which would be far more favourable for us.

[Kayemill]

Not sure if it was freezing rain but on Christmas day 2010 I scraped about an inch of clear ice from my driveway. It was like glass over everything. We didn't even get out for Christmas dinner. The next day there were abandoned cars everywhere. We've had it like that a few times but that was the worst.

Edited February 8, 2012 by Kayemill

[LomondSnowstorm]

http://www.tutiempo.net/en/Climate/EDINBURGH_GOGARBANK/01-2009/31660.htm

http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/climate/uk/2009/january.html

Freezing rain on the 6th January 2009. I remember that one fairly well, was billed to be a big snowfall but we just ended up in the warm sector.

[Scottish-Irish Skier]

Looks like it could be a touch of snow followed by freezing rain for me.

Nice - should give the winters a workout!

Only problem will be other ice skaters....

I recall black ice on the Ediburgh bypass last winter. Cars were flying along happy as larry until they had to brake then 'oh onions'.

Saw two cars which had spun off that morning. With the winters on the ice was hardly noticeable.

[Hairy Celt]

Was over west today, feeling our 'entrenched cold' getting pushed out although it didn't feel that much warmer at the end of the afternoon. The ground is still hard above the bottoms of the straths with great icy bulges lurking treacherously round every corner.

Guess where I was:

Shouldn't be too difficult, it's one of the familiar angles of two of the better known north-westerns although I admit it's not the clearest picture - blame the weather!