Spring moans, ramps, chat and banter

[knocker]

Very neat

 

[Spikey M]

23 hours ago, snow freak said:

I'm throwing in the towel now as far as this winter is concerned.  It's been utter tripe and can't wait to see the back of it now.  Even easterly winds can't give us the cold we so deserve.  I just hope next winter isn't as bad as this one (surely it cant be?).  I just hope we get some decent summer weather to make up for the last few months (although saying that knowing the UK weather, we will probably have the coldest summer in 100 years.lol

 

We all know Winters tend to come in mild/cool clusters with the odd extreme thrown in. Unfortunately, our current cluster is one of the US being shut in the freezer and sending the Jet stream flying straight at us.

We can but hope it ends soon!

Edited February 27, 2016 by Spikey M

[ManiaMuse]

13 hours ago, stevofunnelcl said:

Winters without snow

Summers without storms

Friggin Uk Weather

I got to go to the bloomin mountains of Scotland to see a little snow

Where to go for Summer Storms, Germany usually get some humdingers

Last summer had one of the best electrical storms I can remember in the UK up here in Manchester. Also saw that amazing storm in the early hours in London in 2014.

Summer storms are really just about being in the right place at the right time.

[Spikey M]

52 minutes ago, ManiaMuse said:

Last summer had one of the best electrical storms I can remember in the UK up here in Manchester. Also saw that amazing storm in the early hours in London in 2014.

Summer storms are really just about being in the right place at the right time.

I have always loved storms and we tend to do quite well here in the South East, but last summer we had a storm that started 2 house fires, set off car alarms and generally sounded like a war had kicked off. After that I don't look forward to storms as much. It was scary.

[mpkio2]

For the whole winter season, I have kept my opinions and thoughts to myself (Concerning the weather and the search for cold), always holding on to hope that some cold weather would, eventually, arrive.

However, seeing how we are at the end of Feb, I too must throw in towel and pull the curtain over what I believe to be one of the borinest winters we've had to suffer for quite a few years.

We are currently in a N/NE flow and the GFS is toying with the idea of high Greenland blocking in March...NO THANK YOU!

If cold weather doesn;t appear in the Winter months, I really couldn;t carless. Disregarding March 2013, cold weather in Spring is just dreadful - a East flow in March would only equal 8/7c and overcast cloudy days.

I'm sorry I'm going on a tirade here, but I really had to finally let it all out.

Oh well, here's to a great Summer and a better Winter next season.

~mpkio2~

[mountain shadow]

2 minutes ago, mpkio2 said:

 

We are currently in a N/NE flow 

And yet temps in the SE are progged at 8 degrees in Winter!

Shocking. 

[Daniel*]

6 minutes ago, mountain shadow said:

And yet temps in the SE are progged at 8 degrees in Winter!

Shocking. 

A rather icy ENE wind blowing through here still a reasonable 6C in mid winter with a modest cold pool on the mainland - I'm sure the temps wouldn't have been far from freezing. 

[SLEETY]

even with a ne wind we cant get cold uppers,its a complete joke,if this warming of the Artic continues i cant see it changing anytime soon

[interested & confused]

7 minutes ago, Daniel* said:

A rather icy ENE wind blowing through here still a reasonable 6C in mid winter with a modest cold pool on the mainland - I'm sure the temps wouldn't have been far from freezing. 

It does feel colder then 6C with that icy wind. Chimney doesn't draw very well when the winds from that direction so not feeling that warm inside either

I'd like it to warm up a little and be dry for a couple of weeks so the allotment can dry out and get dug - is that asking too much

[snowfish1]

Now we have fantastic Synoptics at long long last, there's no cold air or snow to tap into talk about extract the urine ....

[I remember Atlantic 252]

yes, good charts for hillier areas oop norf again, had enough now come on Summer

[knocker]

 

[Spah1]

If blocking in March = cold but not cold enough for snow then it can bugger off. 

My cricket season starts on the 23rd April so I'd rather start looking for Spanish plumes. 

[Captain Shortwave]

   

Surface temperatures in this set up today, 5-8C.

Words cannot say how poor a result this is, at least there was sunshine. I guess the contribution of the sunshine amounts and a fairly mild continent were a contributing factor to seeing a cold set up turn out near to slightly below average temperatures.

Moving onward, more chances of northerly or easterly flows developing in an amplified set up but again there is very little to tap into (forecast 850s are a degree or so higher than we have see during this spell with surface temperatures again looking quite similar to what we are seeing). 

So this feels like limbo really, stuck in a situation where early spring warmth is very unlikely with the chances of snow looking rather slim too away from the hills. Not great to be honest.

Edited February 27, 2016 by Captain Shortwave

[I remember Atlantic 252]

trouble is Dec is when you need these setups, not late Feb, but not possible in Dec due to raging Atlantic

[Daniel*]

5 minutes ago, I remember Atlantic 252 said:

trouble is Dec is when you need these setups, not late Feb, but not possible in Dec due to raging Atlantic

Well 2010 proved otherwise it is rare but not impossible at all, I prefer early cold considering the shorter daylight hours by February, Spring is on the back of your mind.

Does Wednesday not interest you? 

I would not say it would be exclusive for northern hills either you have some elevation too...

[I remember Atlantic 252]

early cold way better, late Feb is just too warm, but seas the other way too cold for decent showers, Dec colder land/temps warmer seas bigger showers

Wed does not interest me, models overdo snow potential, can guarantee nearer time that will downgrade to north only

[March Blizzard]

24 minutes ago, I remember Atlantic 252 said:

early cold way better, late Feb is just too warm, but seas the other way too cold for decent showers, Dec colder land/temps warmer seas bigger showers

Wed does not interest me, models overdo snow potential, can guarantee nearer time that will downgrade to north only

Have you forgotten just how mild the December just gone was? It would take a record warm March to beat the CET value it recorded. In a typical year, February will be colder than December. Late February/early March, temperature wise, is on a par with early to mid December. It's also typically snowier than December. The coldest February is colder than the coldest December. Even with very favourable conditions, such as December 2010, it still wasn't colder than February 1986, for example. There is a lot more ice in the Arctic in Feb compared to December, the seas are colder, much of Eurasia is colder in February. Pretty much the whole northern Hemisphere, outside of Maybe the Western half of North America, is colder in February than December.

Yes, it may be too warm in late Feb/early March to see snow/cold for most of us in the UK this year, but only because of how warm much of the northern hemisphere has been throughout Winter. Not at all helped by that ridiculously warm December.

I just don't get people looking for snow as early as October, when it is incredibly unlikely, and then giving up in February or March when there's a decent chance of it falling. It happens every year, regardless of how the season pans out beforehand. I just find it a little odd, but each to their own, and to be fair I don't begrudge people looking for a bit of "warmth".

[March]

Because people want a snow event, as in snow being on the ground for a few days at least. Simply seeing some snow fall and not settling is hardly an event. 

[March Blizzard]

48 minutes ago, March said:

Because people want a snow event, as in snow being on the ground for a few days at least. Simply seeing some snow fall and not settling is hardly an event. 

Of course. That sort of thing is more likely in February or first half of March than October or November, even December. Look at the met office average maps, more days snow falling and lying in February than December. Similar days of snow falling between March and December, for the 1981-2010 average, yet in the previous 2 averages March has slightly more.

Last year I had snowcover that lasted for at least 4/5 days into Feb after a big fall in late Jan. it's been a long time since I've had lying snow in December. Not really a surprise, just closer to the climatic norm.

Either way, in much of lowland England, snow tends to be marginal/transient regardless of what month it falls in. Bit of a moot point really.

 

 

[Walsall Wood Snow]

1 hour ago, March Blizzard said:

Have you forgotten just how mild the December just gone was? It would take a record warm March to beat the CET value it recorded. In a typical year, February will be colder than December. Late February/early March, temperature wise, is on a par with early to mid December. It's also typically snowier than December. The coldest February is colder than the coldest December. Even with very favourable conditions, such as December 2010, it still wasn't colder than February 1986, for example. There is a lot more ice in the Arctic in Feb compared to December, the seas are colder, much of Eurasia is colder in February. Pretty much the whole northern Hemisphere, outside of Maybe the Western half of North America, is colder in February than December.

Yes, it may be too warm in late Feb/early March to see snow/cold for most of us in the UK this year, but only because of how warm much of the northern hemisphere has been throughout Winter. Not at all helped by that ridiculously warm December.

I just don't get people looking for snow as early as October, when it is incredibly unlikely, and then giving up in February or March when there's a decent chance of it falling. It happens every year, regardless of how the season pans out beforehand. I just find it a little odd, but each to their own, and to be fair I don't begrudge people looking for a bit of "warmth".

It probably has a lot to do with the anticipation that the coldest/darkest quarter of the year lies ahead, whereas now we're headed towards what is generally the second warmest season of the year (disputably due to Spring snowfall possibly being slightly more common than Autumn snowfall in the British isles at least, especially in the early stage) and with daylight hours increasing, that Winter feeling is giving way. Although I agree with you generally being as the records show that March and April have probably on average delivered more snowfalls than October and November but at the same time due to a tweaking Sun in the later two months anything that falls is more likely to stick around. But then again the synoptics are rarely favourable to give lying snow much chance to stick around in late Autumn anyway despite the shortening days in this part of the world (and very often as this one shows in the depths of Winter itself) so physiology undoubtedly plays a part in expectations at that time of the year as opposed to now. Not to mention that then actual Winter lies just around the corner at that time of year (so even if we get some short lived lying snow then, many feel they might not have to wait too long for something longer lasting) whereas now we will probably (unless March by some miracle gives us a break) will ha e to go through the whole of Spring, Summer and Autumn until we can hope for some sustained Snow cover, despite that being rare most Winters anyway. But hey if lottery players didn't think they would ever stand a chance they would probably stop playing. Then again I think most of us on here know that a classic on the lines of say 1946/47 or 1962/63 is improbable in any particular year anyway. It's just a Winter with a cold and snowy spell or two like Winter 2012/13 (and no I'm not thinking about the exceptional March when I say that, just the Dec-Feb period) that most of us hope for.

[Frost HoIIow]

55 minutes ago, Walsall Wood Snow said:

It probably has a lot to do with the anticipation that the coldest/darkest quarter of the year lies ahead, whereas now we're headed towards what is generally the second warmest season of the year (disputably due to Spring snowfall possibly being slightly more common than Autumn snowfall in the British isles at least, especially in the early stage) and with daylight hours increasing, that Winter feeling is giving way. Although I agree with you generally being as the records show that March and April have probably on average delivered more snowfalls than October and November but at the same time due to a tweaking Sun in the later two months anything that falls is more likely to stick around. But then again the synoptics are rarely favourable to give lying snow much chance to stick around in late Autumn anyway despite the shortening days in this part of the world (and very often as this one shows in the depths of Winter itself) so physiology undoubtedly plays a part in expectations at that time of the year as opposed to now. Not to mention that then actual Winter lies just around the corner at that time of year (so even if we get some short lived lying snow then, many feel they might not have to wait too long for something longer lasting) whereas now we will probably (unless March by some miracle gives us a break) will ha e to go through the whole of Spring, Summer and Autumn until we can hope for some sustained Snow cover, despite that being rare most Winters anyway. But hey if lottery players didn't think they would ever stand a chance they would probably stop playing. Then again I think most of us on here know that a classic on the lines of say 1946/47 or 1962/63 is improbable in any particular year anyway. It's just a Winter with a cold and snowy spell or two like Winter 2012/13 (and no I'm not thinking about the exceptional March when I say that, just the Dec-Feb period) that most of us hope for.

Not so sure Spring is the second warmest season. If you look at the CET and average temps from weather stations across the UK they will show Autumn is a bit warmer than Spring through recorded history. September is a warmer month than May for example, I think the seas around us are warmer in September than May. Yet there is considerably more daylight in May but September is still generally a warmer month.

Most places in the UK don't record a first air frost until around the middle of October or later for some areas. Yet we can still get frosts in April or May despite the nights being a lot shorter.

We had snow cover here in April 2012 but I've never known that happening in early September when the sun strength is the same as when we got that snow. We have a "lag effect" to our climate in this country due to the seas around us taking their time to cool down and warm up. Winters don't *usually* get going until some point in January despite December having the shortest day. And the risk of snow can linger on through into March and some years into April despite much more daylight. Also the warmest Summer temps are not normally in June when there is the most daylight but it's usually from some point in July to mid August when we are most likely to see the highest temps of Summer. Again it's the "lag effect"

Edited February 28, 2016 by Frost HoIIow

[I remember Atlantic 252]

5 hours ago, March Blizzard said:

Have you forgotten just how mild the December just gone was? It would take a record warm March to beat the CET value it recorded. In a typical year, February will be colder than December. Late February/early March, temperature wise, is on a par with early to mid December. It's also typically snowier than December. The coldest February is colder than the coldest December. Even with very favourable conditions, such as December 2010, it still wasn't colder than February 1986, for example. There is a lot more ice in the Arctic in Feb compared to December, the seas are colder, much of Eurasia is colder in February. Pretty much the whole northern Hemisphere, outside of Maybe the Western half of North America, is colder in February than December.

Yes, it may be too warm in late Feb/early March to see snow/cold for most of us in the UK this year, but only because of how warm much of the northern hemisphere has been throughout Winter. Not at all helped by that ridiculously warm December.

I just don't get people looking for snow as early as October, when it is incredibly unlikely, and then giving up in February or March when there's a decent chance of it falling. It happens every year, regardless of how the season pans out beforehand. I just find it a little odd, but each to their own, and to be fair I don't begrudge people looking for a bit of "warmth".

Agree about Feb being coldest month and Dec warmest, but isn't that only because of frequency of Atlantic air/low pressure? surely if we had exactly same setup mid Dec and mid Feb, mid Dec would be colder, seas colder also in Feb, colder still in march

[AderynCoch]

7 hours ago, Captain Shortwave said:

   

Surface temperatures in this set up today, 5-8C.

Words cannot say how poor a result this is, at least there was sunshine. I guess the contribution of the sunshine amounts and a fairly mild continent were a contributing factor to seeing a cold set up turn out near to slightly below average temperatures.

Moving onward, more chances of northerly or easterly flows developing in an amplified set up but again there is very little to tap into (forecast 850s are a degree or so higher than we have see during this spell with surface temperatures again looking quite similar to what we are seeing). 

So this feels like limbo really, stuck in a situation where early spring warmth is very unlikely with the chances of snow looking rather slim too away from the hills. Not great to be honest.

I knew conditions weren't ideal but those charts are simply unbelievable. Not to mention how we manage to end up with stupidly mild temperatures and daily CET records being challenged if the wind veers even slightly south of west (as happened a few days back).

A lot of folks on here lament late February for snow prospects but we should be doing a lot better than this given the synoptics. A lot, lot better.

 

[Weather-history]

9 hours ago, Captain Shortwave said:

 

Moving onward, more chances of northerly or easterly flows developing in an amplified set up but again there is very little to tap into (forecast 850s are a degree or so higher than we have see during this spell with surface temperatures again looking quite similar to what we are seeing). 

So this feels like limbo really, stuck in a situation where early spring warmth is very unlikely with the chances of snow looking rather slim too away from the hills. Not great to be honest.

That is the problem with easterlies. You need a cold pool to tap into otherwise they deliver little. Who remembers March 1996? There wasn't a lot of snow but that was a very easterly month. Most days were cloudy and cool and that was it. The North Sea despite being cold didn't do anything other than making  sure  any winds were nagging.

Edited February 28, 2016 by Weather-history
.